In case it wasn't readily apparent how good a deal Poul has given us on the OE...

[Biginboca]

Another company is producing almost the same watch and pre-selling at $1195, or about 30% more! Check this out...

Korsbek:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Biginboca/drawing1.jpg

Zinex:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Biginboca/ZNXNGPRO.jpg

Hmmm... looks like an almost dead ringer to me except for the missing crown guard on brand "x", and actually these prints even have the same Fricker document number in the bottom right "GE-20683-01"... Doh http://www.sparkimg.com/emoticons/weirdface.gif!

IMO the Korsbek has a better looking dial and hand set and is definitely an incredible bargain. Thanks Poul :-!

[Skipdawg]

Very interesting indeed. Yeppers thanks Poul. ;-)

[subkrawler]

Another company is producing almost the same watch and pre-selling at $1195, or about 30% more! Check this out...

Korsbek:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Biginboca/drawing1.jpg

Zinex:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Biginboca/ZNXNGPRO.jpg

Hmmm... looks like an almost dead ringer to me except for the missing crown guard on brand "x", and actually these prints even have the same Fricker document number in the bottom right "GE-20683-01"... Doh http://www.sparkimg.com/emoticons/weirdface.gif!

IMO the Korsbek has a better looking dial and hand set and is definitely an incredible bargain. Thanks Poul :-!

Good catch BIB, it really does show how good of a deal the OE is.:-!

I bet if we had an OE and Zinex side by side, the differences would appear greater. If you look close, the OE's lugs are more square and angular. You already pointed out the crown guards, but the bezel profile is different too.

Of course these differences wouldn't affect price, but I don't think the two are the same watch, except for the dials and hands.

[Tragic]

Poul are there protections against Ocean Explorer look-a-likes?

[frogonwheels]

Thanks for the info. It is actually a bit " scary ". How can they even share the same number from Flicker ?
Who's this other company ?
Would be great to have Poul jump in ?

[frogonwheels]

I typed the Zinex watch company and found its website : http://www.zinexwatch.com
It keeps on amazing me that stuff like that can happen. I read a lot of forums and watch stuff and yet never heard of Zinex ?
I don't think their watch has the HRV and also the hands are not the same as far as I can tell. But all that is always interesting....
If we can't get our hands yet on the OE, please Poul let us dig our teeth into some photos or something !!!1

[jclevoy]

I typed the Zinex watch company and found its website : http://www.zinexwatch.com
It keeps on amazing me that stuff like that can happen. I read a lot of forums and watch stuff and yet never heard of Zinex ?
I don't think their watch has the HRV and also the hands are not the same as far as I can tell. But all that is always interesting....
If we can't get our hands yet on the OE, please Poul let us dig our teeth into some photos or something !!!1

Their logo and stuff looks eerily like Zeno Watch Basel. I wonder if they are related???:think::think::think:

Plus, I think the Korsbek is hands down a better looking watch:rodekaart:rodekaart:rodekaart:rodekaart

[subkrawler]

Their logo and stuff looks eerily like Zeno Watch Basel. I wonder if they are related???:think::think::think:

Plus, I think the Korsbek is hands down a better looking watch:rodekaart:rodekaart:rodekaart:rodekaart

I just checked out their website, and it seems the company is all about rip-offs. The logo for their "Nitrox" dive watch, is a rip-off of the OMS logo

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y246/tydes/oms-logo-82b.gif

For the case-back, they rip-off the US Navy's Scuba Diver insignia, aka the "bubble head".

And what's up with what's supposed to be printed on the case-back..."Zinex Watch Company Technical Divers Association":-s

I think I'll email them, and ask them if I can join.:roll::-d:-d

[subkrawler]

OK, speaking of rip-offs, I went back to the Zinex site and checked out their "pilots" watch. They ripped off the Zeno "airplane" logo and the Blancpain "no-radiation" symbol.<|<|

I can't believe they can't do any better than that. That's beyond lame.:roll::-|

[poulbrix]

Poul are there protections against Ocean Explorer look-a-likes?

Hi John,

Unfortunately, there are no protections against look-a-likes.

I am going to ask Fricker to sign an exclusive deal that I am the only one to use the OE case.

The case on the Zinex is not the same as the OE. The lugs are different and the Zinex has no crown guards.

[Malyel]

Fricker is a catalog case manufacturer.;-) This is probably the first of many watches that will share it's design with the Ocean Explorer. Fricker makes very good watches but sadly they start to all blend together when the same case is used by numerous start ups. :think:

[Dookie]

hmmm,
i was directed to this link by another WIS. very dubious indeed. The korsbek is not a catalog case, its seems strange that they would produce the same watch at the same time. I very much doubt whether even the Zinex is fricker made? Can anyone confirm this? Poul? :-s:-s

[jclevoy]

hmmm,
i was directed to this link by another WIS. very dubious indeed. The korsbek is not a catalog case, its seems strange that they would produce the same watch at the same time. I very much doubt whether even the Zinex is fricker made? Can anyone confirm this? Poul? :-s:-s

With the way they are "borrowing" all of the logos and other things.....I bet the cases are chinese. No offense to Chinese cases as I know they have some rather well made cases. It is just that they seem to have shady deals going as well<|

[Dookie]

if it is in fact just a copy then it must be the worst case of blatant replication. They literally stole the technical drawing from this forum n claim it as their own.( too lazy even to change the series no.) However, until we get concrete confirmation, i guess Zinex do have benefit of doubt. Innocent till proven guilty yea? :-d:-d

[nursegladys]

I have to say that looking at the tech drawing of the diver; the bezel is different to the photo of the watch........check out the way the bezel looks; there is definitely a double chamfer on the photo, yet there is no double chamfer on the drawing...........very strange

[narwhal]

Here is something interesting. When I googled Zinex - I came across a forum post on "the big watch" forum from Sinichi about the Zinex flightmaster. Sinichi is a WUS member who sold an A.Louis here a couple months ago. The A.Louis was supposed to have been made by Fircker and is a dead-ringer for the Kenzo. See here: http://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?p=798724

I wonder if he knows something about the Zinex - Fricker connection.

Here is a link about Zinex discussed on WUS: http://forums.watchuseek.com/archive/index.php/t-112575.html

[workaholic_ro]

if it is in fact just a copy then it must be the worst case of blatant replication. They literally stole the technical drawing from this forum n claim it as their own.( too lazy even to change the series no.) However, until we get concrete confirmation, i guess Zinex do have benefit of doubt. Innocent till proven guilty yea? :-d:-d


Now I'm very sure that my watch case is going to be done in my home town even if it's not in Swiss and no one will ever see a blueprint before the damn thing is ticking. o|o|o|
No idea if I'll ever make a small production but I'm very determined to have at least one piece done.
It' a shame, these things can put serious obstacles in peoples work. :rodekaart
Good luck Poul and Korsbek:-!

[DaveB]

I looked at the Zinex artwork and it appears to be changes to Poul's CAD drawing. This was not done by Fricker. It looks like a photoshop or cut-and-paste job. Take a good look at the lines. You can see where they tried to erase some of the artwork from Poul's design and overlay theirs. The bezel is just filled-in at the base, that slope of the edge is cut at a sharper angle, then the measurement tag for the bezel insert is moved over this area to look like a measurement of the slope length. Very poorly done and in very poor taste.

Fricker also doesn't usually send their drawings with a reverse color background (i.e., black background).

This a real con job. Even if they do get the cases (probably from China), and the movements (probably from China), and assembly (probably from China), the eventual owners will be lead to believe these are quality time pieces from a second rate flim flam artist.

Just my opinion. Not trying to burst the value bubble...

BTW - the A.Louis that was supposed to have been made by Fricker - check out the spelling of the Mako shark on the back of the watch in Narwhal's post. I usually see these type of errors on poor quality reproductions. Again, unlikely a Fricker.

DaveB

[oversize]

Hello to everyone....here is what has happened on ZINEX, the case was supplied by an overseas company to ZINEX which has indicated that has nothing to do with Fricker DESIGN, the issue is the web person who made the web-page used the picture that is similar, here is a copy of the actual Email that went to FRICKER org, an honest mistake......this is the actual Email....

"We thank you for your information, we contacted the supplier of the case manufacturer and he has assured us this is not your case or has anything to do with your design, in regards to the picture on the website, this was a mistake in part by website marketing company who is no longer associated with us, who used to create our website. We take these matters very seriously and have immediately removed this picture from our site. We assure you we have no intentions of copying any of your design or intellectual properties.

Please let us know if we can assist any further.

ZINEX WATCH.....

[55Kingpin]

Hello to everyone....here is what has happened on ZINEX, the case was supplied by an overseas company to ZINEX which has indicated that has nothing to do with Fricker DESIGN, the issue is the web person who made the web-page used the picture that is similar, here is a copy of the actual Email that went to FRICKER org, an honest mistake......this is the actual Email....

"We thank you for your information, we contacted the supplier of the case manufacturer and he has assured us this is not your case or has anything to do with your design, in regards to the picture on the website, this was a mistake in part by website marketing company who is no longer associated with us, who used to create our website. We take these matters very seriously and have immediately removed this picture from our site. We assure you we have no intentions of copying any of your design or intellectual properties.

Please let us know if we can assist any further.

ZINEX WATCH.....

Join Date: March 19th, 2008

Posts Total Posts: 1 (1 posts per day)


Hmmmm.......

Are you related to Zenix in any way?

[oversize]

Join Date: March 19th, 2008

Posts Total Posts: 1 (1 posts per day)


Hmmmm.......

Are you related to Zenix in any way?


Yes....good customer, love their watches, I like small companies who try to make it, I will give them a chance......I know they are a very small company, they may have made a bad judgment on letting someone do their web-design who should not have done what they did, but I do not belive they deserve to be rediculed for a mistake, at least they have the integrity to stand up and reply to Friker org and correct any mistake they had made.......

[Carl.1]

Good for you oversize.

[DaveB]

I am not ridiculing them, only identifying what they did as dishonest.

You say the CAD used was "similar". Similar to what? Does this mean the web site misrepresented the watch by posting a CAD of something different than was being sold (similar does not count). The watch in the picture does not match the CAD posted. The lug designs are completly different. The bezel top is different. The CAD is also missing key elements where it appears to have been touched-up (i.e., the bezel attachment to the case, bottom cover mounting grooves, etc.).

I contend the picture is from Poul's OE and had to be modified intentionally (you can't change a drawing you don't own by mistake). The odds of having the same drawing number with such a similar design is nearly impossible.

The founder being a Mechanical Engineer should know this. There had to be a review and approval process by Zinex of the web page prior to release. These things don't "just happen". Again, the watch in the picture doesn't match the CAD posted. A ME should easliy pick this up.

The posting of that CAD has corrupted the integrity of the web site and the company. The response you provided only provides more concerns by saying it was someone elses fault.

By the way, the email should have gone to Michaela or Walter at w-fricker.de not Fricker org. I assume this is in error, but fricker.org will go to an Octoberfest celebration in Colorado. :-d

DaveB

[oversize]

I am not ridiculing them, only identifying what they did as dishonest.

You say the CAD used was "similar". Similar to what? Does this mean the web site misrepresented the watch by posting a CAD of something different than was being sold (similar does not count). The watch in the picture does not match the CAD posted. The lug designs are completly different. The bezel top is different. The CAD is also missing key elements where it appears to have been touched-up (i.e., the bezel attachment to the case, bottom cover mounting grooves, etc.).

I contend the picture is from Poul's OE and had to be modified intentionally (you can't change a drawing you don't own by mistake). The odds of having the same drawing number with such a similar design is nearly impossible.

The founder being a Mechanical Engineer should know this. There had to be a review and approval process by Zinex of the web page prior to release. These things don't "just happen". Again, the watch in the picture doesn't match the CAD posted. A ME should easliy pick this up.

The posting of that CAD has corrupted the integrity of the web site and the company. The response you provided only provides more concerns by saying it was someone elses fault.

By the way, the email should have gone to Michaela or Walter at w-fricker.de not Fricker org. I assume this is in error, but fricker.org will go to an Octoberfest celebration in Colorado. :-d

DaveB

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++:rodekaart
Hello,

I want to personally thank you for stating the facts in the watch you seek Forum. Please rest assure we are not a type of company that practices an ethical behavior. Since you are the member of this Forum, I greatly appreciate to set the record straight.

I trust you since you have clearly stated the facts that we indicated to Fricker group.

Here is the fact behind ZINEX NITROX and yes you may post this on the public Forum for everyone to see.....

As a professional Divemster with PADI org ( Lic #0801058434 ), I personally wanted to create a dive watch that was unique in certain respect to ZINEX brand other than large pilot watches that is our main focus. We had an opportunity to purchase already made 100 pieces out of 300 units of 2005-2006 already produced product for a large car company that had the logo on the crown, dial, backcase branded with their logo, with different set of hands. To me this watch had a perfect case to make the NITROX with. The dial, backcase, hands and bracelet had to be manufactured new for the Nitrox watch. This project is already two years old....So the idea that we have replicated this case from anyone is NOT true. The fact is our local web-design person who is no longer handling any of our business created these pictures and we regretfully are sorry. As we said an oversight on our part. I personally apologize to Flicker group and any other person that because of our oversight we have offended.......

Joe S.
Founder
ZINEX WATCH

[Biginboca]

Well all's well that ends well. If there is anything to be learned here it's still that the OE is going to be a heck of a watch and terriffic bargain to boot!

[subkrawler]

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++:rodekaart
Hello,

I want to personally thank you for stating the facts in the watch you seek Forum. Please rest assure we are not a type of company that practices an ethical behavior. Since you are the member of this Forum, I greatly appreciate to set the record straight.

I trust you since you have clearly stated the facts that we indicated to Fricker group.

Here is the fact behind ZINEX NITROX and yes you may post this on the public Forum for everyone to see.....

As a professional Divemster with PADI org ( Lic #0801058434 ), I personally wanted to create a dive watch that was unique in certain respect to ZINEX brand other than large pilot watches that is our main focus. We had an opportunity to purchase already made 100 pieces out of 300 units of 2005-2006 already produced product for a large car company that had the logo on the crown, dial, backcase branded with their logo, with different set of hands. To me this watch had a perfect case to make the NITROX with. The dial, backcase, hands and bracelet had to be manufactured new for the Nitrox watch. This project is already two years old....So the idea that we have replicated this case from anyone is NOT true. The fact is our local web-design person who is no longer handling any of our business created these pictures and we regretfully are sorry. As we said an oversight on our part. I personally apologize to Flicker group and any other person that because of our oversight we have offended.......

Joe S.
Founder
ZINEX WATCH

Joe,

Thanks for stepping up and addressing this issue. While I have your attention, you may want to address the issue regarding your "nitrox" logo. The red and yellow, double scuba tank logo, is a design rip-off of the Ocean Management Systems logo. See below:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y246/tydes/oms-logo-82b.gif

Also, the logo on your pilots watch is eerily similar to Zeno. You also used the Blancpain "no-radiation" symbol which is very unoriginal.

Perhaps if you showed a bit more originality in certain design elements, I might be willing to take your products more seriously.

[oversize]

Joe,

Thanks for stepping up and addressing this issue. While I have your attention, you may want to address the issue regarding your "nitrox" logo. The red and yellow, double scuba tank logo, is a design rip-off of the Ocean Management Systems logo. See below:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y246/tydes/oms-logo-82b.gif

Also, the logo on your pilots watch is eerily similar to Zeno. You also used the Blancpain "no-radiation" symbol which is very unoriginal.

Perhaps if you showed a bit more originality in certain design elements, I might be willing to take your products more seriously.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++

It has been addressed,.....

[MizzouGuy]

First let me say that I was one of the first to pre-order an Ocean Explorer and I am looking forward to the watch more than any other this year.

But as for the originality of the Zinex watch or any other watch, there is almost nothing that hasn't been done. Some of the design features of the OE have been inspired by classic dive watches. I just don't understand why everyone is so quick to judge or choose sides. As I said in another post, people who own a dreadnought get all bent out of shape by the OE and Kenzo because the case is similar and produced by Fricker. Can't we all just get along.

I think that this Zinex watch topic has been beaten to death and if I were Kosbek i would want this forum to be dedicated to how amazing his watch is and not getting caught up on another watch company.

Now can we please, please, pretty please have some more production pictures of the OE

[Carl.1]

Must admit Zinex intrigue me.

I do believe they are copy artists with thier designs and logos. Their prices are also way over the mark for me.

But.....i am intrigued, i think i'll keep dipping into their website.:think:

Any way back to Korsbek......can't wait:-!

[Teddyhanna]

You know sometimes we just have to go there, and in the end "It's all good".....but Joe you rock....|>

[yamahaki]

there dive does have that gp bezel thing going on though, looks pretty cool

[jon.d]

As a professional Divemster with PADI org ( Lic #0801058434 ),
Joe S.
Founder
ZINEX WATCH

Not to hijack the thread or pile on, but that is not an international PADI DM # according to my sources. Joe - where were you certed (country) and what year?

[Joe.S]

Hello Jason, I received an Email from one the members telling me you are asking a lot of questions about ZINEX and creating negativity...:( well I finally decided to join this Forum to answer your question personally....., I have few registrations with PADI and NAUI and other organizations overseas. I am not really sure why you are so interested to spread rumors, or if you are somehow associated with other companies or firms, but just to answer your question, I also happen to love diving timepieces and I have been diving since 1988, have a few certifications, specialty in deep diving ( technical diving ), the recent was as a Divemaster with PADI 2008........since you have sources as you indicated, I am sure you can confirm with them......my latest certification PADI No is 237953, now If this site is as professional as it appears to be, hopefully we can put an end to these type of inquiries.......Kind Regards,

JOE.S

[jclevoy]

Joe,
My response is in the DWF, as I believe it is a more appropriate venue for this discussion

[narwhal]

Thanks Jason for posting on this stuff. It's a shame Kawasaki (or whatever) closed the thread. JoeS. did a poor job of answering your concerns. he never addressed why he stole the OMS symbol and tried to rationalize the Zeno rip-off without addressing why their name appeared in the exact same way. Also, apparently they don't have web access in Chicago, which is why he didn't notice the company he runs was using stolen blue-prints. It's just one thing after another....

His company bought up a bunch of cheap Chinese cases which were made for Corvette and are making some cheap mods and reselling them. Does anyone doubt they would have sold them with mineral crystals if people haddn't started screaming foul?

Compare all of this with what Poul is doing and tell me where $800 is better spent.....

[Tragic]

We're not going to move this argument here because Sean closed it in the DWF.
This thread began with significant relevance to Korsbek enthusiasts and I believe that's been thoroughly discussed.
I'd encourage Joe.S and Zinex to see Ernie about sponsorship here on WUS so as to better promote his products.
This is closed as well.