Wagner WTY movement

[iFunky]

Hi,

I would like to buy a watch with a mechanical movement but with my student budget ... O|

Wagner since 1948 have models with low prices :
Momentus (http://www.momentus.fr/shopdetail.aspx?idMontre=157)
Time World (http://www.time-world.de/html/shop.html)

What do you thing about this brand ? chinese of course ... but reliable ? and about the movement : a WTY 2868 for this watch (http://www.momentus.fr/shopdetail.aspx?idMontre=157). An ETA replica or clone ? like the ETA 2878 (http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&uswk&ETA_2878)

iFunky

[GMF]

This looks like the Tianjin ST17, which is also used in my Invicta 9980.

http://www.tjseagull.com/20041230/manage/upfile/20041228133042936.jpg

[iFunky]

ok and this movement is reliable ?

By the way, where can i find alpha watches in Europe ?

[Frank Valentin]

A friend of mine is collecting swiss watches. He owns a lot of the big names (IWC, JLC, Rolex, you name it...). After I showed him a Sea Gull he got quite enthusiastic. The prices are so affordable, it seems that he buys them by the dozen :-D Now he´s stuck between a rock and a hard place: The chinese quality is near his expensive timepieces and the timekeeping is better :-D
I suppose this says a lot...

BTW, take a look at my mini-review: http://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=1553

[iFunky]

A friend of mine is collecting swiss watches. He owns a lot of the big names (IWC, JLC, Rolex, you name it...). After I showed him a Sea Gull he got quite enthusiastic. The prices are so affordable, it seems that he buys them by the dozen :-D Now he´s stuck between a rock and a hard place: The chinese quality is near his expensive timepieces and the timekeeping is better :-D
I suppose this says a lot...

BTW, take a look at my mini-review: http://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=1553

OK thanks !

[GMF]

ok and this movement is reliable ?

By the way, where can i find alpha watches in Europe ?

Actually, after looking at that movt a little closer it appears to be the ST16.

http://www.tjseagull.com/20041230/manage/upfile/2004122813114270.jpg

I have several Alpha watches with this movt and I've found them to be reliable and very accurate.

The best place to get Alpha watches is off of ebay or directly from the Alpha web site: www.alpha-watch.com.

[iFunky]

HI,

I think i forget wagner because the watches are really too big for me ... :-S

Alpha has sometimes an italian style, but one watch catchs my attention, do you know the movement ?

Thanks,

iFunky

[Chascomm]

Alpha has sometimes an italian style, but one watch catchs my attention, do you know the movement ? Tianjin Sea-Gull ST17. This appears to be substantially an upgrade of the ST16 (one page on the Sea-Gull site refers to both as a single series of movements), however unlike the ST16, the ST17 is not hackable.

[iFunky]

and the final one ... ;-) an ETA like from SeaGull ?

[Chascomm]

and the final one ... ;-) an ETA like from SeaGull ?Not quite. The balance is in the same place, but notice the direction of the balance-cock. That looks like a Shanghai/Diamond movement.

Which is interesting as this means that there are at least 3 factories making 'Lange-1'-style movements (big date, off-set main dial, small retrograde for additional function). I guess the assembler rotated the dial/movement to make it look less Lange-like, but the result is a bit like a 'biker dial' (i.e. optimized for reading while riding a bike).

[iFunky]

ok, it's not usual for chinese watches to be lange-like ... it's interessting ... thanks !

[iFunky]

i think i found a similiar movement here :

http://www.chinawatch-clock.com/cpgg/shanghaiwatch/image/2HN40A-0-1.jpg

[Chascomm]

:-! Well spotted.

To give you a bit of background on the movement. In 1982, Shanghai Number 1 watch factory and Shanghai Diamond collaborated to create a new thin hand-wind mid-man-size calibre (I guess to compete with the thinner quartz watch that were beginning to become popular). Primarily it seems to have been aimed at the domestic market where mechanical watches would remain the norm for many more years. As the Chinese economy opened up, and mechanical watches began to regain popularity in the wider world, a 35 jewel automatic version was created to be used as the basis of a bewildering range of date complications for the export market. The more basic Diamond SB1ZZ day/date auto is also available to the Chinese market. It is an accurate and reliable movement (although the QC of the various brands that use Shanghai movements can vary a lot).

[iFunky]

Hi,

is there a website where i could find more information about the Diamond SB1ZZ ?

;-)
Thanks

[Chascomm]

Hi,

is there a website where i could find more information about the Diamond SB1ZZ ?

;-)
ThanksSorry, the only English language info that I have regarding Shanghai watches is the links shown on out Chinese Industry Links article:
http://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=746
I can't figure out how the movement designations listed on one of those sites (e.g. 08ZR00) relates to the designations under the old State-regulated system (e.g. SB1ZZ) :-S

The same problem is present with Seagull movements. The Tianjin factory uses the ST designations, whereas their international distributor Tsinlien uses their own TY codes (or WTY for Wagner)

I've lost a link to a Chinese language detailed history of Shanghai watchmaking O| but it only went as far as the development of the hand-wind version of what is now the SB1ZZ. So all I can say is that it is an original Chinese design, not a copy of a foreign movement, and it has a good reputation for reliability and accuracy.

[iFunky]

ok ! i will take a look at your link thanks ...

by the way i received the watch ... may be i could attach picture of the movement ...

[iFunky]

After a more closer look on it i would say that the ceramic black & white dial is a "la chaux de fonds 1738 - tourbillon repetition minute" by jaquet droz like, the similitude are impressive (there is even the three lived blue) :-!

Of course, the movement has nothing to do with the jaquet droz one ! :-(