Laco Baumuster B Blued Hands: Who's in, who isn't ?

[frank_be]

Hello everyone,

this thread is just to ALL let me know if you want to join the blued hands project yes or no. This is important for the price setting of the hands.

You can also give your opinion on what TYPE of hands you would prefer:

Format:

Forumname: watchnr(s)
Blued Hands: YES or NO
Type: REAL STEEL or BLUED BRASS

PLEASE KEEP THIS THREAD CLEAN. Post all other remarks to the original thread.


Greetings,
Frank

[frank_be]

So I go first:


Frank_be: 45/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Paulo]

Paulo: 17
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Lencoth]

Leo/lencoth: 24
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

Thanks, Frank!

[Sandy]

Sandy: 31/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[pepellf]

pepellf: 44/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

regards

[Frode]

Frode: 09/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[inlanding]

inlanding: 37/50 (waiting arrival)
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

Glen

[Erik_H]

Erik_H: 03/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Janne]

Janne: 02/50
Blued Hands: Yes
Type: Real Steel

Jannes Wife: 50/50
Blued Hands: Yes
Type: Real Steel

[daviswalker]

daviswalker: 27/50
Blued Hands: Yes
Type: Real Steel

[Biggie_Robs]

Biggie_Robs: 21/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[montana]

montana: 49/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[hotnerd]

Bhanu/hotnerd: 01/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Nalu]

Colin/Nalu: 10/50
Blued hands: YES!
Type: STEEL!

TWO sets please.

[wildcat82]

Brett/wildcat82: 32/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Lars]

Lars: 23/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[yycwatchdog]

yycwatchdog: 28/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[TIMEangel]

TIMEangel: 38/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[ParkinNJ]

ParkinNJ: 36/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Mud]

Mud: 16
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[waltherpfalz]

WaltherPfalz: 26/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL


Greetings!!
WaltherPfalz

[brainless]

brainless: 46/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL:thanks

[BRUCE]

Bruce: 11/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[yenfoolun]

Bruce: 20/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Mescalito]

Mescalito: 13/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[CKH2359]

CKH2359: 34/50
Blued Hands: NO
Watch hands type:Very satisfied with current watch config.

[bigflax925]

bigflax925: 04/50
Blued Hands: YES!
Type: REAL STEEL

[bigwill]

bigwill: 30/50 (waiting arrival)
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

Cheers from Dubai

[BKM]

BKM: 06/50
Blued hands: Yes
Real Steel: Yes

[bullitt731]

Bullitt731: 47/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Sandy]

Well, it's been a week now and I estimate that about thirty people responded.

What's the next step?

I'm anxious to get this moving because I hate the hands that came with the watch. There is so much white on the dial that I have to "hunt" to find the hands in order to read the time. I don't have this problem with my type A Stowa watch because the blue hands provide a contrast between the black dial and the white lume on the hands.

I'm willing to take anything at this point in order to be able to glance at the time; blue hands, red hands, yellow hands, I don't care!

[Janne]

Be aware that the blue part on the hands will only be a very thin strip on the edge, just like the black on the existing hands. The rest will be lumed, same as now.
Of course, the widest area on the minutehand will be much closer to the tip, so it will be more visible!

[frank_be]

I have counted 29 'yes' and 1 'no' so we're still missing 20 votes.

I want to go forward with the maximum number of participants to keep the price down as much as possible.

Greetings,
Frank

[Crusader]

I want to go forward with the maximum number of participants to keep the price down as much as possible.

Seeing that Laco are turning the LE into a serial watch, I was wondering whether the blued hands project need necessarily remain a very limited edition of 30-50, or whether Laco might now have an interest in procuring a larger batch, and selling them as an optional extra with the watch, like regular watch costs €x, with steel-blued hands it costs €x+y.

At least something worth exploring, if that hasn't been done yet.

Just my two bezants' worth.

[frank_be]

Seeing that Laco are turning the LE into a serial watch, I was wondering whether the blued hands project need necessarily remain a very limited edition of 30-50, or whether Laco might now have an interest in procuring a larger batch, and selling them as an optional extra with the watch, like regular watch costs €x, with steel-blued hands it costs €x+y.

At least something worth exploring, if that hasn't been done yet.

Just my two bezants' worth.

I will definitely talk that over with Mr Pfeiffer.

Greetings,
Frank

[Paulo]

I'd try to mail the remaining owners before moving any further.
To help that I've done this list in Excel (sorry for the look, I swear it looks quite tabular on Excell). If Bhanu can provide the adresses I could drop them a mail with the link to this thread, asking for their reply.

Number Nick Blued Type
1 hotnerd Y RS
2 Janne Y RS
3 Erik_H Y RS
4 bigflax925 Y RS
5
6 BKM Y RS
7
8
9 Frode Y RS
10 Nalu Y RS
11 BRUCE Y RS
12
13 Mescalito Y RS
14
15
16 Mud Y RS
17 Paulo Y RS
18
19
20 yenfoolun Y RS
21 Biggie Robs Y RS
22
23 Lars Y RS
24 Lencoth Y RS
25
26 waltherpfalz Y RS
27 daviswalker Y RS
28 yycwatchdog Y RS
29
30 bigwill Y RS
31 Sandy Y RS
32 wildcat82 Y RS
33
34 CKH2359 NO
35
36 ParkinNJ Y RS
37 inlanding Y RS
38 TIMEangel Y RS
39
40
41
42
43
44 pepellf Y RS
45 frank_be Y RS
46 brainless Y RS
47 bullitt731 Y RS
48
49 montana Y RS
50 Janne Y RS

[ht8306]

Hi, I'm keen. But does it mean I have to sent the watch back to Laco? Will I be double taxed?

Forumname: ht8306
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Paulo]

Your watch number is missing.

Format:

Forumname: watchnr(s)
Blued Hands: YES or NO
Type: REAL STEEL or BLUED BRASS

Let's put it a bit differently...

Forumname:
Watchnr(s):
Blued Hands: YES or NO
Type: REAL STEEL or BLUED BRASS

[DeDe]

Forumname: DeDe 15/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type:BLUED BRASS

[Sandy]

You forgot me! See post number 5 in this thread.

[Paulo]

Sorry, now you're in. :oops:

[CKH2359]

Hi Sandy

I absolute agree with you. You are not the only one facing this problem. I find that there is just too much white on the dial and makes the face a tad crowded. Like you, I have the "hunt" for the time. If the hour hand and minute hand are together (1.05, 2.10, 3.15, 4.20, etc), I almost always "accidentally" take the second hand as the minute hand.

I am not sure what is wrong with the dial design (maybe it is just me). I looked at my IWC mark 12, which has a smaller dial and I can read the time (and date) off quickly; but for this dial, it takes a while to register the time.

I endorsed the design from the beginning to the end so I cannot complain. And this is a very well made watch. On hindsight, I felt that the second hand should be thinner and maybe black/yellow/red in colour. The minute markers should be thinner and shorter too.

I doubt the steel blued hands will make a big difference because the blued portion is applicable only to the edges of the hands, but the white lume is still there. Somehow, I suspect the lume affects the way I read time using the hour and minute hands. But in pitch darkness, the watch is a marvel to look at :)

The above are just candid thoughts after I used the watch continuously for the last few days.

Cheers

KH

[Crusader]

I doubt the steel blued hands will make a big difference because the blued portion is applicable only to the edges of the hands, but the white lume is still there. Somehow, I suspect the lume affects the way I read time using the hour and minute hands. But in pitch darkness, the watch is a marvel to look at :)

KH, with the different shape discussed, there will be no chance to mistake the minute hand for the second hand.

Perhaps someone making the same observation you did 65 years ago prompted the change from baumuster A to Baumuster B ... ;-)

[Janne]

Perhaps someone making the same observation you did 65 years ago prompted the change from baumuster A to Baumuster B ... ;-)

Yes, and ended up over Glasgow instead of the London Docks!
I know I should not joke like this. Sorry all Brits that lost a relative during WW2 ". Truly sorry.

Another thing: We have decided on the shape, have we not? I do not recall reading that confirmation!

[CKH2359]

Martin, thanks for the reminder. Indeed, if the black hands were designed in the shape as later proposed for the blue hands, I would certainly see time better.

But to pay euro 100+ (as previously communicated) for a pair of hands ... it is not something I would go for now. I can still train myself to adapt to the current black hands specs. :)

Cheers

[Janne]

Yes, that is it!! It will solve the "invisibility" problem!

[ht8306]

Sorry Paulo...

Forumname: ht8306
Watchnr(s): 08/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Hary]

Forumname: Hary
Watchnr(s): 29/50
Blued Hands: YES
Type: REAL STEEL

[Paulo]

List update: 16 MIA :rodekaart
(32 RS, 1 BB, 1 NO)

Number Nick Blued Type
1 hotnerd Y RS
2 Janne Y RS
3 Erik_H Y RS
4 bigflax925 Y RS
5
6 BKM Y RS
7
8 ht8306 Y RS
9 Frode Y RS
10 Nalu Y RS
11 BRUCE Y RS
12
13 Mescalito Y RS
14
15 DeDe Y BB
16 Mud Y RS
17 Paulo Y RS
18
19
20 yenfoolun Y RS
21 Biggie Robs Y RS
22
23 Lars Y RS
24 Lencoth Y RS
25
26 waltherpfalz Y RS
27 daviswalker Y RS
28 yycwatchdog Y RS
29 Hary Y RS
30 bigwill Y RS
31 Sandy Y RS
32 wildcat82 Y RS
33
34 CKH2359 NO
35
36 ParkinNJ Y RS
37 inlanding Y RS
38 TIMEangel Y RS
39
40
41
42
43
44 pepellf Y RS
45 frank_be Y RS
46 brainless Y RS
47 bullitt731 Y RS
48
49 montana Y RS
50 Janne Y RS

[DeDe]

sorry, i said blue brass

[Paulo]

Corrected, thanks. :-)

[Frode]

Not answering is also a way of showing you are not interested.

How about setting a time limit? No response within, say, 1 week, is a no.

Then we go ahead with the number we have and get a price.

Just a suggestion...

[Paulo]

We could do that after an email to the rest.
It's not that I want to push the blued hands to them, it's that I want a better price for the hands. ;-)

[inlanding]

I agree, but since this is a one-time shot at completing such a wonderful timepiece and such a wonderful project. I hope there is not too much languishing before we make a decision to order.

The blued hands with that wonderful large blue-handed minute hand will make that watch even more spectacular than it already is.

I am ready to go with ordering.

Glen

[Janne]

Yes, time to order.

[Sandy]

Who changed the title of this post? This is Laco Baumuster B Blued Hands, not A.

[Crusader]

Who changed the title of this post? This is Laco Baumuster B Blued Hands, not A.

Thanks for pointing out the mistake. I did change severeal thread titles, as I was getting the impression that the threads could be confused by new members, what with now both a Baumuster A in the making, and a Baumuster B still being delivered. Doing those two watches in chronologically reversed order did not help. ;-)

[inlanding]

I am ready to order the Steel blued hands upon notification for the Baumuster B

Glen

[hwilsdorf]

Sorry guys im still on the sidelines with this one. If we get 50 guys, will the cost of Euro 100+ go lower or this is it? I think this is the biggest rip-off of the year! Maybe half the cost went to shipping charges?

It's like owning a $20,000 car with a $4,000 wheels on it? At the end of the day, our engines are still 1.6 liter 4cyl (ETA).

Please enlighten.

[Janne]

Hwilsdorf! See this as a Porsche 912.
I will try to contact no 39 Vlado, I do not think he is a regular on WUS.

Done, email sent.

[Biggie_Robs]

Sorry guys im still on the sidelines with this one. If we get 50 guys, will the cost of Euro 100+ go lower or this is it? I think this is the biggest rip-off of the year! Maybe half the cost went to shipping charges?

It's like owning a $20,000 car with a $4,000 wheels on it? At the end of the day, our engines are still 1.6 liter 4cyl (ETA).

Please enlighten.

I definitely agree that 100+ Euro is a crazy price, but I *have* to have that sword-shaped minute hand. :-p

[hwilsdorf]

LOL! :-) :-) Good analogy! What about ..... a Porsche 924 with 20" rims? :-) :-)


Hwilsdorf! See this as a Porsche 912.
I will try to contact no 39 Vlado, I do not think he is a regular on WUS.

Done, email sent.

[Frode]

I'm also curius as to the final price.

100 euro has become 110.... For that price I can get a Seiko Black Monster on the bay. :-|

Anyone have a realistic estimate?

[Nalu]

I can't speak to this specific case, but it's well known that flame blued steel hands are very expensive.

1. There is a high rejection rate due to the vagaries of heating metal to a specific temp for a specific time.

2. If the hand manufacture is different, new hand molds must be made by the company doing the bluing.

[DeDe]

Hi,

i think the real steel blue hands wouldn`t be the best choise, because they don`t look very nice blue. This week I was in the watch museum in Glashütte and had a look at the Lange & Söhne B-watch. The original hands look only in some situation or specific angles blue. Most of time they look black or grey. So real steel is for me to much money for a little effect. The bigger effect for me is the wide minute hand and this effect I can get with chemical blued hands and can also save money for other projects.

Just my two cents ;-).

Dede

[Janne]

Hi,

i think the real steel blue hands wouldn`t be the best choise, because they don`t look very nice blue. This week I was in the watch museum in Glashütte and had a look at the Lange & Söhne B-watch. The original hands look only in some situation or specific angles blue. Most of time they look black or grey. So real steel is for me to much money for a little effect. The bigger effect for me is the wide minute hand and this effect I can get with chemical blued hands and can also save money for other projects.
Just my two cents ;-).Dede

And to be realistic, the blued area is very, very thin. I take which ever blue hands the concensus will be. Janne

[Paulo]

I've counted 32 for blued steel, 1 for painted hands and 1 no new hands.

Only 16 missing, that won't change the present status.

[CKH2359]

I am getting used to the watch, although I am still sometimes vexed by the thin minute hand.

Just a thought, if I remove the second hand, will my watch still works fine?

[Sandy]

I think that it's time to get these hands on order or forget the whole thing.

Enough time has gone by.

To whoever is in charge, what's the next step?

[hotnerd]

Ok, since nobody is taking the lead, I will email Mr. Pfeiffer on Monday to begin the blue hands order. Some thoughts for this weekend on the blue hands:

- First, regardless of which blue hands we receive, the best thing is that Frank_be has corrected the shape of the hands and will send the vector file to Laco (when Frank_be has completed his daytime work). This should correct the thin hands and add to the authenticity.

- The blue hands have to be ordered in the minimum quantity of 100 (50 sets) from the Swiss supplier. The suppliers in Switzerland are very cautious as to who they sell to due to lot of politics behind the scenes. Laco is a small watch company, so they do not have many suppliers that will sell to them. There is only one supplier that will customize the hands for Laco. That supplier requires minimum quantity of 100 hands.

- We cannot combine Baumuster B 100 hands with Baumuster A project since the shape of hour hand is different. The supplier will consider that as separate order of 100 hands.

- Do we have all 50 Baumuster B owners willing to participate in blue hands project? Unfortunately not. In hindsight, we should not have placed blue hands as an option, but as part of the features with 650 euros watch price.

So, I will explore all possiblities with Laco on Monday to get at least 35 real steel blue hands. If not possible, to get painted blue hands. Will this be acceptable?

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Erik_H]

Thanks for driving this, Bhanu. I really hope we can come to an agreement of the steel blue hands, our watches are near to perfection and this is the only missing bit. I am willing to go all the way with our project and I hope more than the 35 who have already showed their interest will voice up. It is no or never, get the perfect Laco B or for ever regret that the watch is only "almost there".

Erik_H

[Nalu]

Per my previous post, I'm willing to buy two pair of blue steel hands.

[Piccolo8]

Hello all,

I was unfortunately too late for this fantastic project. I am even new to this forum but please allow me to post a comment.

Why don’t you ask/allow LACO to launch Baumuster “B” UNLIMITED EDITION featuring blued steel hands with the price of 650EUR?

By this way, Mr. Pfeiffer can order at least 50 pairs of blued steel hands or possibly more for a better price than 100EUR.

I know the result of your discussion over the thread “Laco Baumuster "B" UNLIMITED EDITION" but if you take a poll now, you might get a consensus.

Those who missed “B”LIMITED EDITION might be glad to buy UNLIMITED EDITION with blued steel hands. I will, definitely.

Best wishes,

[Janne]

+ 1 ,Piccolo8 !
Maybe Laco will offer the "unlimited B" only with Blued steel hands?
If they use them on all the unlim. B's, the order will exceed 100 units, and bring the cost down, from which we also will benefit!

[ht8306]

Hi Bhanu and Erik,

I'm in. Thanks for driving this Bhanu, and I agree with Erik that I do not wish to look back and say that the Baumuster B was almost there just because of another EUR100.

Henry

[Crusader]

+ 1 ,Piccolo8 !
Maybe Laco will offer the "unlimited B" only with Blued steel hands?
If they use them on all the unlim. B's, the order will exceed 100 units, and bring the cost down, from which we also will benefit!

:-s I thought the "unlimited B" idea was discontinued by Laco in favor of the "limited A" ? :think:

[Nalu]

I thought so also Martin. The blued hands issue was yet another reason (though less significant) for my support of the Unlimited Bau B watch from Laco.

[Janne]

:-s I thought the "unlimited B" idea was discontinued by Laco in favor of the "limited A" ? :think:

Yes, you are right, I forgot. The title of this thread confused me.
So no chance of getting the cost down, unless Laco moke a larger order to fit them onto one of the existing Laco "Baumuster almost B" watches!

If we have to order 100 units, and only 32 takers, does it mean we will need to split the total cost among us 32?

Would the hands be less expensive if the steel was chemically blued?
You see, I keep looking and comparing the 55mm and 42mm with a loupe, and this is what I think:
The blued area is really thin ( less then 0,5mm) on the 55mm, even thinner on the 42mm. Is it really worth it spending this money on such a small detail as heatblueing.
Do not forget, the hands need to be shipped and installed too!
So we are looking at maybe 150-180 euros for each watch??
Initial estimation was 30 Euro plus installation.

How do we know the original hands were heat blued??
I have looked back through the threads, but all I find is opinions, not real facts!
The Laco was made in Germany by a German workforce. A country known for it's efficiency.

Would they really have spend the time to heat blue and get a large failure rate in wartime??
I somehow do not think so!
I think they used a chemical process, unless somebody shows a WW2 spec document stating that the hands had to be heatblued.

It is never too late to rethink. I know that if we "32" change our minds, the majority of "the 50" will order them.
I guess that the 16 absent do so becauce of cost. I understand them!!
I think we should try to bring the cost down to a more accesible level, so we ALL can get the perfect watch!

To keping the cost on this level, we have excluded 1/3 of the LE B owners.
And more will bow out if the cost will go up!

So, I think we should rethink, and get the hand chemically blued, if this is not possible, get the painted-blue ones.
Just my 2 cents.

[Piccolo8]

:-s I thought the "unlimited B" idea was discontinued by Laco in favor of the "limited A" ? :think:

In my understanding, LACO offered LMITED A idea to use up remaining materials from LIMITED B project because there were some negative opinions when UNLIMITED B idea was introduced.

To realize blued steel hands project, if LIMITED B 50 owners take a poll now and say OK for UNLIMITED B, there is no reason why LACO stay away from the idea of UNLIMITED B for more WUS members.

I assume they can produce more cases and get more movements (=modified 2824) while waiting for blued steel hands.

By the way, according to Mr. Pfeiffer’s comment forwarded by Bhanu, he wrote “LACO will not offer the "Unlimited Edition B" through watchUseek forum”.

From this sentence, I understand that he is still having an idea of UNLIMITED B for outside of WUS markets.

Isn’t it better to ask LACO to produce UNLIMITED B with Blued steel hands exclusively for WUS members, than let him sell similar watches outside of WUS community?

It is a WIN-WIN solution for LIMITED B 50 owners( to cut down cost for blued steel hands project), other WUS members and of course, LACO.

[Janne]

I too think Laco will serieproduce the B-watch. So they should, it is a perfect design, they too spend a lot of time and money in making it happen!
I do not think they made much profit out of this, and Laco is afterall a business!

We may feel this is "our" design and watch. Yes, we did a lot of work, but we worked on an old Laco design. We painstakingly recreated it, not designed it!

[CKH2359]

Regarding the heat-bluing, that was exactly what I mentioned in my earlier post. This process is very time-consuming and I would considered as "luxurious", would WWII watch factories able to produce this in time for distribution to the pilots?

BTW, Euro 100, in my country is still quite a lot of money.

Cheers

[Janne]

Regarding the heat-bluing, that was exactly what I mentioned in my earlier post. This process is very time-consuming and I would considered as "luxurious", would WWII watch factories able to produce this in time for distribution to the pilots?

BTW, Euro 100, in my country is still quite a lot of money.

Cheers

Exactly my point! As with all military ordering, the supplier had a very tight budget. The stuff has to be made exactly to the specs, and still make a profit for the supplier.
Looking in a high magnification, the blueing is uniform.

Euro 100 = US$ 126 is a lot of money in most countries. Excluding poss. shipping cost and cost of installation!

What is the general feel amongst you about "downgrading" to chemically blued steel?

[Sandy]

Chemically blued is just fine with me. I'll take anything in order to get rid of these black hands. In fact, all blue all the time would be better than heat-blued because then I would not have to orient the watch in order to see the blue.

[bullitt731]

I will support whatever we can come up with as long as we use Frank_be's design. It's his design IMHO that will enhance the watch more so than the bluing process we choose.

We will just have to see what Laco can make available to us, but I do think we should conclude this project soon while there is still interest in it.

Lets get them ordered, :-! hopefully by the end of the month.

[Lencoth]

i will support whatever we can come up with as long as we use frank_be's design.

+1!

[Biggie_Robs]

I just want a sword-style minute hand. Heat-blued would be great, but if that isn't going to happen I will be happy with chemically blued brass hands.

[Piccolo8]

Regarding the heat-bluing, that was exactly what I mentioned in my earlier post. This process is very time-consuming and I would considered as "luxurious", would WWII watch factories able to produce this in time for distribution to the pilots?


Alright. If you LIMITED 50 owners go for chemical blued hands, Mr. Pfeiffer would be able to launch UNLIMITED B with sword-style heat blued hands to differentiate it from LIMITED B in the near future:-d.

I’ll patiently wait for it.

By the way, I understand that the idea of heat blued hands is to make stronger and rust protective pieces than untreated steel.

I see a lot of vintage watches, both military and civilian, with blued steel hands from the era including WWII period, except for luxurious solid gold watches with solid gold hands.

I mean no bitterness and I am sorry to disturb your discussion.

Good luck!:-!

[Paulo]

I will support whatever we can come up with as long as we use Frank_be's design. It's his design IMHO that will enhance the watch more so than the bluing process we choose.

Agreed. If the black hands on the watch had the original shape I'd be more than happy. :-!

[Hary]

I will support whatever we can come up with as long as we use Frank_be's design. It's his design IMHO that will enhance the watch more so than the bluing process we choose.

We will just have to see what Laco can make available to us, but I do think we should conclude this project soon while there is still interest in it.

Lets get them ordered, :-! hopefully by the end of the month.

+1. Shape is more important than the bluing process. I will go along with the majority

[Biggie_Robs]

Agreed. If the black hands on the watch had the original shape I'd be more than happy. :-!


My feelings exactly. |>

[Janne]

So you are OK with the chemically blued hands, as long as the shape is authentic?
Personally I am!

Just a note to Piccollo8: Both the processes of Heat blueing and Chemical blueing are to increase the Rust-resistance.
Of old, guns were heat blued, untill the Chemical process was discovered.
Today, the chemical blueing process is used on the vast majority of non-s/s, civilian guns, !

[hwilsdorf]

Sorry to sound like a cheapskate (yes I am) :-), whats the price difference between blued and chemical blued hands? Thanks Janne!



So you are OK with the chemically blued hands, as long as the shape is authentic?
Personally I am!

Just a note to Piccollo8: Both the processes of Heat blueing and Chemical blueing are to increase the Rust-resistance.
Of old, guns were heat blued, untill the Chemical process was discovered.
Today, the chemical blueing process is used on the vast majority of non-s/s, civilian guns, !

[Nalu]

Several points:

1. Laco has not specified whether the Swiss company making the blued hands is doing it by heat or by chemical bluing.

2. The choice, and therefore the cost difference, is between PAINTED blue hands and BLUED hands (as in chemical or heat-blued).

3. German production is known for efficiency AND attention to detail (QUALITY). The early war years were very demonstrative of this, with the quality of kit being markedly better than that of their opponents (optics, metallurgy, etc.). To the point where the QUALITY choices got them into trouble on the battlefield as there were no 'kludges' or part-swapping possibilities. For example, there were almost no parts in common between the PzKw IV, PzKw V, PzKw VIa and PzKwVIb. In the later years (after the losses of 6th Army in Stalingrad and the DAK), shortcuts were taken due to effects of shortages in material and money. This was long after the B-uhren were specified and produced from what I can tell (I see deliveries in 39-42 in Knirim's book, but I don't read German - maybe Crusader can help). As a fan of military history, I could go on and on but I wanted to make the point that there are some gross misunderstandings being posited as facts here.

4. Janne, your assumption that the folks we haven't heard from about blued hands is completely unsupported. It reminds me of the surgeon who thinks all of his patients are doing fantastic because they never come back for follow-up. If they don't speak up, we have no way of knowing what they think and any assumptions are misleading.

[Janne]

Nalu! Yes, I assume we have not heard from them because they are not interested because of the increasing cost.

I do not think the difference chemically blued or heatblued is a quality difference!
The endresult, resistance to oxidation, is virtually the same.
One process is old, the other one newer?

[brainless]

I will join majority - important is the original "belgian" shape, designed by Frank:-!


Volker

[inlanding]

The value of having Frank_be's designed replacement steel blued hands exceeds its price for such a unique watch, so it is worth it to me to have them. If the watch were 100EUR more expensive at the onset, I'd still have purchased the watch just the same.

If it's determined too many people don't think it's worth it for such a unique timepiece, I'll go for the chemically treated ones.

Glen

[Janne]

Just a thought:
Looking on Laco's production, all the watches with "Baumuster B" looking dials have the "Baum. A" hands.
The problem we have (cost) is due to the limited amount of hands produced. Wonder if Laco would be interested in putting the " belgian B-hands" into normal production?
If they change the shape to the B-shape, but have them black painted, it is not a problem for us to get a small number blued.
(The size of the "belgian B" will fit size wise the "ordinary" Laco dials.)
This would benefit all of us, including Laco!

[hotnerd]

Gents,

We have a green light from Laco for the painted blue hands with our (Frank_be) design.

I am working out the details as Frank_be has to still provide the vector file of hands to Laco. I will email and post the ordering process in next couple of days to Baumuster B members.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Janne]

Gents,

We have a green light from Laco for the painted blue hands with our (Frank_be) design.

I am working out the details as Frank_be has to still provide the vector file of hands to Laco. I will email and post the ordering process in next couple of days to Baumuster B members.

Cheers,
Bhanu

:-!:-! Bhanu, you are a star!

[Nalu]

:-(

[hwilsdorf]

Painted blue? I thought blued steel was what most are after? Or are they gonna offer us both options? Thanks!



Gents,

We have a green light from Laco for the painted blue hands with our (Frank_be) design.

I am working out the details as Frank_be has to still provide the vector file of hands to Laco. I will email and post the ordering process in next couple of days to Baumuster B members.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Biggie_Robs]

So you are OK with the chemically blued hands, as long as the shape is authentic?
Personally I am!


Yes, I am! :-)

[hotnerd]

Painted blue? I thought blued steel was what most are after? Or are they gonna offer us both options? Thanks!

Right now it just does not seem like everyone has one voice and everyone can be pleased. There are members who want blue steel hands, others who do not want to spend the 100+ euros, some who want to keep the black hands, supplier who does not accept less than 100 hands order.

I am almost ready to call it quits, but I am making a last attempt to get everyone on board.

I am personally more than ok for either option. But if you can figure out a way to build consensus for 50 members and non-members to order steel blue hands, please speak up :-)

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Janne]

Watch 2/50 and 50/50:
Preference:
1: Chemically blued steel ( if cost lower than 110 Euro)
2: Blue lacquered brass
3: Heat blued steel (cost 110 Euro)

Keeping the Black hands is not an option.

Janne

[garaventa]

Watch 2/50 and 50/50:
Preference:
1: Chemically blued steel ( if cost lower than 110 Euro)
2: Blue lacquered brass
3: Heat blued steel (cost 110 Euro)

Keeping the Black hands is not an option.

Janne

Good morning,

this is also exactly my point of view.

1: Chemically blued steel ( if cost lower than 110 Euro)
2: Blue lacquered brass
3: Heat blued steel (cost 110 Euro)

I will change the hands, that´s for sure an I accept the costs for the special hands. It´s much money (110€) but I want to have this nice watch to be perfect!!

Let´s make this project come true as fast as possible:-!

Garaventa

[bullitt731]

I may be wrong, but here is where I think we are.

Flame Blued= Very expensive and doubtfull that we could get the number of hands needed to fill an order. It would seem that Laco has no interest in making this an option hence we are on our own. Not much chance here IMHO.

Chemically Blued= Hopefully less expensive than Flame Blued. The lower cost could help some people on the sidelines step up. Laco may possibly have some interest in offering these going forward as an option on a similar watch in the future as well.

Painted Hands= Not as nice as either of the other two options, but again better than retaining the stock hands. Again Laco may consider this an option for future watches.

For the most part we have around 30 wanting to do something. More may be interested in the 2nd, or 3rd choices if we had a firm price to offer them.

The bottom line is Laco has to be on board, and whatever process they are comfortable with if any will dictate what we can get. If they can tell us what they will support, and how much it will cost it is pretty much a take it, or leave it situation, and we can all vote yes, or no.

[Frode]

I suggest we wait for what Laco has to offer, and open a new "jump aboard" thread when the details are on the table.

Bhanu: you deserve a medal ! :thanks

[hotnerd]

Right now Laco is awaiting the vector file from Frank_be for the hands.
Frank_be is currently busy in his work so it may be couple of weeks before Frank provides the vector file to Laco.

The only option currently available is painted blue hands since we do not have 50 members to proceed with this project.

I will email everyone on the project list with the details and then request a "Interested" or "Not Interested" reply back.

Members that are interested will receive an invoice from Laco for the hands for 10 euros.

Laco will send the vector file to supplier and afer they receive the hands, Laco will ship the hands to us.

We will be responsible for installation from our local jeweller/watchseller. The warrantly will still be good.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[inlanding]

Bhanu, you have gone above and beyond - it is very much appreciated.

If there is a way for us to get 50 orders for heat treated blue steel hands in very short order, then great.

If not, superbly painted/treated ones will have to make the grade and you have a well-made plan for it.

Thank you very, very, much.
Glen

[Biggie_Robs]

Good work, Bhanu! :thanks

[hotnerd]

:thanks Gents

Our collective goal is to make this a special project and I am not giving up till it is complete. It may not be perfect steel blue hands but we'll work within the given constraints and still get the perfect design and blue hands :-)

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Nalu]

I may be wrong, but here is where I think we are.

Flame Blued= Very expensive and doubtfull that we could get the number of hands needed to fill an order. It would seem that Laco has no interest in making this an option hence we are on our own. Not much chance here IMHO.

Chemically Blued= Hopefully less expensive than Flame Blued. The lower cost could help some people on the sidelines step up. Laco may possibly have some interest in offering these going forward as an option on a similar watch in the future as well.

Painted Hands= Not as nice as either of the other two options, but again better than retaining the stock hands. Again Laco may consider this an option for future watches.

For the most part we have around 30 wanting to do something. More may be interested in the 2nd, or 3rd choices if we had a firm price to offer them.

The bottom line is Laco has to be on board, and whatever process they are comfortable with if any will dictate what we can get. If they can tell us what they will support, and how much it will cost it is pretty much a take it, or leave it situation, and we can all vote yes, or no.

Not picking on Bullitt, but once again I'll state that the company offering to make the blued hands did not specify heat or chemically blued. All they specified was that they would do 100 sets and that each set would be 110 Euros. IOW, we don't have a three-way choice for blued hands. We have a two-way choice: painted brass or blued steel.

Bhanu, I can appreciate your frustration. Why not set up a poll? A poll makes it a simple matter to vote, no reasons need be included - we've all had our say who are willing to do so.

[hotnerd]

It was only a choice between steel blue hands and brass painted blue.

Laco has agreed to supply brass painted blue hands.

I am not sure what the poll will accomplish at this point since I have recieved several emails either stating that black hands are sufficient or steel blue hands to too expensive to participate. If we cannot get ALL 50 members to order the steel blue hands, that option is no longer valid.

But anyone is welcome to start a thread with poll. I will vote :-!

Cheers,
Bhanu

[bullitt731]

Not much chance we can get all 50 members to get on board so it looks like this project may have to be shelved.

However, if someone wants to start another poll you can put me down for 2 sets at the price stated if it helps to get us to 50.

[yenfoolun]

begining i also opted for blued steel... but now seems not all take up and the price is killing off the project...

should we consider printed blued straight on the baumuster A and this... then ask laco to order 100 printed blue straight... its only euro10 for baumuster B member... and euro 560 for baumuster A project....

i was told most heat/flame blued also using chemical... no longer blued in flame and put into flax seed oil like the old days... its easier to control the color...

so to me as long the shape is correct i'm ok now... but black hands is not acceptable... we are not using old material to build our case, not using tritium for luminous paint... so nothing wrong with printed blued hands...

and time and money already pushing the project too far away now... i cant wait...

[Nalu]

not using tritium for luminous paint... so nothing wrong with printed blued hands...


The lume used on the original beobachtungsuhrs was Radium and there really was an option for using it. However, we do (did) have the option to use an authentic finish for the hands.

IME, there is a big difference between the appearance of flame blued hands, chemically blued hands and painted hands. It's amazing to me that we agonized over every case, dial, crown and hand detail, and then couldn't give a fig about the finish on the hands o|

[Janne]

You are right, Nalu, but the initial estimate was 30 Euro for 50 sets. Then it went up to 110 Euro for 50 (?) sets.
Unfortunately, only 32 sets were preliminarily ordered. I guess "the 32" would need to split the cost for the 50 sets?
50x 110 = 5500
5500/32 = 172
Or am I wrong?? Would Laco keep the remaining 18 sets and absorb the cost for these?
yes, I would prefer Blued hands. But 110 Euro is a bit steep.
If we had known this, we would have calculated with this from the beginning.
We could also have specified a Chronometer grade movement, to keep in line with the original. But we all felt it was not so important! As long as the "visual" aspect of the watch was as close to 100% as we could get it. Which we certainly did!!
Just mu 2 cents
Janne

[hotnerd]

Jan :thanks

This project was not about getting the exact movement, case, etc. This project was to build an affordable smaller replica of the Laco B.

I personally think forum members who will participate in the brass blue hands with Frank_be design will be again pleasantly surprised :-)

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Janne]

Bhanu! I know what you say. I just wanted to exactly what you said, but you did it better! :-!
To build an affordable smaller replica, which I think we did 100%!
(IMO, visually the BEST replica, by far, on the market, including far more costly alternatives)
That is why I am reluctant to pay 110+ Euro for the hands. 30 Euro as initially estimated is OK. In line with the cost of the watch.

What is more important now is Frank-be's suberb down scaling of the original hands will be succesfully reproduced by the handsmanufacturer.

Frank-be!! You know I am a "sucker" for measurements, so be prepared!! ;-):-d
N.B. Please do not think I am "cheap". I am not. :thanks

[yenfoolun]

The lume used on the original beobachtungsuhrs was Radium and there really was an option for using it. However, we do (did) have the option to use an authentic finish for the hands.

IME, there is a big difference between the appearance of flame blued hands, chemically blued hands and painted hands. It's amazing to me that we agonized over every case, dial, crown and hand detail, and then couldn't give a fig about the finish on the hands o|


thanks for correcting me

[Janne]

And we still do not know if the original 55mm had Heatblued or chemically blued hands.
Unless proven wrong, we should assume the Germans used the more modern, predictable, cost effective and equally effective for this purpose - chemical blueing.

Flameblueing has not been used in the weapons industry for over 100 years, the US handgun makers used that technique to rust proof and harden the steel for the frame and sometimes the drum on revolvers.
The barrells, being more sensitive for distorsion due to heat, were heat blued or chemically blued.
Off Topic, almost.
Years ago, (15 approx) I had a Colt Python .357 custom made by Colt. I specified flame bluing for the frame, among other more technical modifications. Colt had great problems doing that, they claimed the modern steel they used was of the wrong alloy. The frame did not get the classical "irregular" look, was very uniform in colouring.
The barrel and drum received the "secret" Colt Chem. bluing, a really deep, dark blue.

Edit: Just found on Wikipedia, an interesting article "Bluing (steel)
Maybe Laco used the "hot" bluing process?

[Mescalito]

Jan :thanks

This project was not about getting the exact movement, case, etc. This project was to build an affordable smaller replica of the Laco B.

I personally think forum members who will participate in the brass blue hands with Frank_be design will be again pleasantly surprised :-)

Cheers,
Bhanu

:-!:-!:-!

[Paulo]

At this point I just want the hands with the original shape.

If they're blued or black doesn't bother me...

[CKH2359]

Hi Bhanu


How much for the painted brass hands option?


KH

[Lencoth]

At this point I just want the hands with the original shape.

If they're blued or black doesn't bother me...

Agreed, the right shape is paramount & should be the ultimate driver of this project.

[Erik_H]

I have to admit I am disappointed we did not get a consensus for blued steel hands (whatever steel blueing process made use of to achieve it). There is a difference between blued steel and painted brass; blued steel looks black most of the time and only shines blueish when angled towards a light source. Painted brass looks blue all the time. For the original Laco B-uhr the desired effect of blueing was not to create blue colour hands, but rather to make the steel corrosion resistant.

However I will still go with the majority and get the painted blue hands as this seems to be the conclusion. After all only the edges of the hands will be bare surface treated metal, the rest will have luminous compound applied. The end result may actually look quite good, although without the captivating shade of blue to black effect of blued steel.

In the end I will be most happy to get the shape of hands Frank Be has provided us. Thanks Frank!

Erik_H

[hotnerd]

Hi Bhanu


How much for the painted brass hands option?


KH

Per my previous post:

I will email everyone on the project list with the details and then request a "Interested" or "Not Interested" reply back.

Members that are interested will receive an invoice from Laco for the hands for 10 euros.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[CKH2359]

Thank you for the prompt reply. :)

Cheers
KH

[hwilsdorf]

I think we will still own a great looking Baumuster B w/ fatter hands nevertheless! :-! :-!



Per my previous post:

I will email everyone on the project list with the details and then request a "Interested" or "Not Interested" reply back.

Members that are interested will receive an invoice from Laco for the hands for 10 euros.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Fawo]

Dear all

Im so late to reply to this thread regarding Project B blued hands. First to state my preference.

Fawo
48/50
Real blued heated steel

I was informed by Bhanu to pick up #48 on this Tuseday. FedEx arrived at my pariient's home in Hong Kong yesterday GMT0134. I was on the plane flying above Asia. Cant wait to see the watch in 2 hrs time from now and have the blued hand project completed soon.

Anyway sorry to show my hands on this project this late, I'll go all the way to support blued hands on Project B and Project A.


Regards
Fawo

[Biggie_Robs]

agreed, the right shape is paramount & should be the ultimate driver of this project.


yes!

[Lencoth]

I understand that we will hopefully get new 2 blue hands based on Frank's design. This will replace the original hands so that we will have blue minutes and hours hands and the original black seconds hand. Is this combination faithful to the original?

Kind regards.

[Janne]

I understand that we will hopefully get new 2 blue hands based on Frank's design. This will replace the original hands so that we will have blue minutes and hours hands and the original black seconds hand. Is this combination faithful to the original?

Kind regards.

Yes. See below:
Note also the aged lume, difficult to capture in a pic
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk70/jpultr/DSC01523.jpg?t=1225649297

Another angle:
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk70/jpultr/1209558599.jpg?t=1225649360 (http://javascript<b></b>:void(0);)


Please note the very thin blued edge in the minute and hour hands!

Yeu guys can also compare your LE's with this one. You see what a perfect dial the LE has?

[Lencoth]

Thanks Janne, that picture says it all. What a nice watch b-)


Yeu guys can also compare your LE's with this one. You see what a perfect dial the LE has? :-!

[bullitt731]

Per my previous post:

I will email everyone on the project list with the details and then request a "Interested" or "Not Interested" reply back.

Members that are interested will receive an invoice from Laco for the hands for 10 euros.

Cheers,
Bhanu

I thought we still needed 50 sets for Laco to even consider the brass hands; is this correct? I will support whatever we can get made at this point, but I do not want to make a payment unless I know I will receive the product.

[hotnerd]

I thought we still needed 50 sets for Laco to even consider the brass hands; is this correct? I will support whatever we can get made at this point, but I do not want to make a payment unless I know I will receive the product.

Laco is willing to purchase the 50 sets. Laco will not invoice the 10 euros and not deliver the hands ;-)

So be assured that as soon as Frank_be completes the hands design and emails Laco, we will begin the order process.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[hwilsdorf]

Are you positive? 100% sure? :-) :-)


Laco will not invoice the 10 euros and not deliver the hands ;-)



Cheers,
Bhanu

[Hary]

By chance I saw the names of people who has Birthday today. Bhanu is one of them. HAPPY BIRTHDAY Bhanu :-!

[Crusader]

Happy birthday from me too, Bhanu ! :-!

[bullitt731]

Laco is willing to purchase the 50 sets. Laco will not invoice the 10 euros and not deliver the hands ;-)

So be assured that as soon as Frank_be completes the hands design and emails Laco, we will begin the order process.

Cheers,
Bhanu

Thats good enough for me; HAPPY BIRTHDAY as well!!!!!!!!!!

[CKH2359]

Hi Lencoth

I think frank_be hands are only for hour and minute hands. You are still keeping the white lumed seconds hand, not black seconds hand.

Cheers

[CKH2359]

Happy Birthday Bhanu!!

Thank you and really appreciate your effort and work in this project!!

[Nalu]

Yes. See below:
Note also the aged lume, difficult to capture in a pic
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk70/jpultr/DSC01523.jpg?t=1225649297

Another angle:
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk70/jpultr/1209558599.jpg?t=1225649360 (http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:void%280%29;)


Not entirely correct. The seconds hand on the original Laco B-Uhr is blued steel. It may have had black paint on top, but it is blued steel underneath. Look at this seconds where the lume has fallen off: blued steel

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/ColMiller/Laco/p1070970mediumxg9.jpg
(seller's photo, I'm trying to get a bigger version)

[Janne]

Now that is interesting, Nalu!!
It will give it a better rust protection I guess.

I have always wondered why they painted the second hand black when the other are blued!

Another interesting detail:
If you look closely on the square end of the second hand, you will see that the sguare bit is added to the hand.
The hole, can it be just an easy way to hold the hand while they blue/lume/ black paint it?
What do you think?
Interesting crown on that example. Replacement?
Ask the seller for some movement pics, and of the inside of the caseback!

You buying?

[Nalu]

It's my watch that I've posted previously, I just didn't have a photo showing the seconds hand bluing. The watch is all-original.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/ColMiller/Laco/xsLaco1_filtered.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/ColMiller/Laco/watcha11mediumdt7.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/ColMiller/Laco/watcha12mediumrs3.jpg

Yes, I think the hole is a grasping point for the hand and the large back end may have been added for balance in order to avoid an excessive bending moment on the pinion.

[hotnerd]

Happy birthday from me too, Bhanu ! :-!

:thanks Gents

[Frode]

Please let me join the chorus: HAPPY BIRTHDAY! :-)

[brainless]

Let me be the fourth in line ;-)

"Happy Birthday, Bhanu !" :-)


Volker

[montana]

From Romania "Happy Birthday/La multi ani", Bhanu!
Dan-C.

[Janne]

From Cayman: Ya man! Happy Birthday my man!!

[hwilsdorf]

From Manila - Happy Birthday Bhanu! :-! :-! You are a legend in my book! :-) :-)

[yenfoolun]

greeting from Malaysia.... happy birthday

[Sandy]

Any progress on this hands project? Or is it dead?

[frank_be]

Any progress on this hands project? Or is it dead?

It is not dead, I just didn't have the time to put my time into it. From next week on, I will have time again to continue both the blued hands Baumuster B project and the Baumuster A dial and blued hands.
I've been very busy lately at work. I hope you guys understand.

Greetings,
Frank

[Sandy]

I understand.

There wasn't an update in two weeks so I didn't know what to think.

[BKM]

It is not dead, I just didn't have the time to put my time into it. From next week on, I will have time again to continue both the blued hands Baumuster B project and the Baumuster A dial and blued hands.
I've been very busy lately at work. I hope you guys understand.

Greetings,
Frank

I completely understand. You deserve the break; and if I may say, you also deserve a medal for your significant and invaluable contribution for a great watch. Bryan

[BRUCE]

I completely understand. You deserve the break; and if I may say, you also deserve a medal for your significant and invaluable contribution for a great watch. Bryan
I'll second that.

Bruce

[Sandy]

Any progress on the hands? Is this something Laco can do on their own? One way or another I would really like new hands soon. This is one of the reasons I bought this watch. If the hands project is a no go, I'm going to sell the watch.

[Paulo]

Any progress on the hands? Is this something Laco can do on their own? One way or another I would really like new hands soon. This is one of the reasons I bought this watch. If the hands project is a no go, I'm going to sell the watch.

My understanding is that Frank is presently overloaded at work and that has put the project on standby.
Looking at the gains we achieved in the Baumuster B project for having Frank taking care of the dial, I prefer to wait for Frank's availability and contribution than hurry Laco to produce the hands.
So, given the season, I'm patiently waiting for next year to have developements and, of course, if I can be of any help in the process please let me, I'll feel honored to help. :-!

[frank_be]

The CAD-vector files will be send to Mr. Pfeiffer before 2008 is over. Paulo is correct, I do have a lot off work at the moment.

Greetings,
Frank

[yenfoolun]

The CAD-vector files will be send to Mr. Pfeiffer before 2008 is over. Paulo is correct, I do have a lot off work at the moment.

Greetings,
Frank

take your time... no matter how desperate we are, we want you to stay healthy...

so that you wont do it wrongly .... :-d

[Janne]

Agree! And I am truly happy you are busy, Frank!
As an owner of a business to another, you can never be too busy!!!
Specially not in times like this!

I hope you have a nice holliday (applies to all of you, guys!) drink plenty of whatever you prefer, eat plenty, and enjoy!!

[brainless]

eat plenty

What's about sweets and chocolate, Janne? b-)

Have a nice holiday,


Volker

[inlanding]

Thank you, Frank. These updated hands will really make a huge difference in the dial presentation and your efforts are so very much appreciated. Look forward to installing them sometime in 2009!

To all Baumuster B Blued Hands enthusiasts and WUS members: Best Regards from Colorado through this Holiday season,

Glen

Glen

[frank_be]

I just mailed Mr Pfeiffer the files of the hands from our baumuster B replica.

Merry Christmas everbody!

Greetings,
Frank

[CKH2359]

I appreciate you spending time and effort over this!

Merry Christmas to you and your family and may peace and happiness be with you all through the new year.

[TIMEangel]

Frank

Appreciate your expertise, effort and willingness to contribute,

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you.

Regards
TA

[Sandy]

Thank you! Thank you!
This is a great Christmas present!

Now sit back and enjoy a Leffe. You've earned it! I only wish I could buy you one.

[Janne]

Frank! You should be enjoying the family, food and drink, but not working!
Anyway, thanks a lot!

[yenfoolun]

you are just too kind........ MUACK!
Happy new Year

[hotnerd]

Frank you are awesome :thanks

I hope you are enjoying the holidays with family.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Erik_H]

Hi all, I think we can still do what we intended! Blued hands for our B! Thanks Frank, and now we are just waiting for Laco's feedback. After that I hope as many as possible would be as happy as me: The opportunity of a near to perfect watch just as we designed it!

Erik_H

[BRUCE]

Thank you Frank. You have been generous with your time and expertise on our watch project, to the benefit of all of us. I am grateful.

[Janne]

Thank you Frank. You have been generous with your time and expertise on our watch project, to the benefit of all of us. I am grateful.

+ 1 !!
I would like to say, that without Frank-be we would not have reached the goal the way we did.
The new hands will be the cream on the pie.

[inlanding]

With the upgraded hands, it'll be even more amazing...

Thanks for all your efforts in helping to create and distribute this wonderful timepiece Frank, Bhanu...

Glen


http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii285/inlanding/LacoSE/LacoSemiLume1.jpg

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii285/inlanding/LacoSE/IMG_0084-1.jpg

[Paulo]

Revisiting this thread I saw this pic and :-p.
Nalu, can you show us that white dial watch? It looks precious.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/ColMiller/Laco/xsLaco1_filtered.jpg

[Janne]

Yes, that is the one I wanted to be the next WUS LE. It is a fantastic looking watch.
But it was not to be!
It is a KM something field watch. I think. Stowa?

[Mescalito]

any news from laco concerning the blued hands? i got a new pilots strap for my LE type B, so only correct the hands are missing to complete this watch... b-)

[Biggie_Robs]

I just mailed Mr Pfeiffer the files of the hands from our baumuster B replica.

Merry Christmas everbody!

Greetings,
Frank

Does anyone have any idea when/if Laco has plans to do anything with them?

[Lencoth]

Does anyone have any idea when/if Laco has plans to do anything with them?

Bhanu,

I think your invaluable input is needed here :-!.

Regards,


Leo.

[yenfoolun]

it will be good if we can get it back together with our caseback together...
i dont mind to get the printed blue hand now.... at least it look close to original!

[hotnerd]

Update from Laco regarding blue hands project:

"Frank_be has sent me a drawing for the blue hands.
I asked him for meassurement. Did not get info so far."

Frank_be has been busy in work so when Frank delivers the measurements to Mr. Pfeiffer, orders for blue hands will begin :-)

Cheers,
Bhanu

[Biggie_Robs]

So we still have no idea when the blued hands will be available?

I can appreciate being busy with work, but at the same time a little communication goes a long way.

[Paulo]

So we still have no idea when the blued hands will be available?

I can appreciate being busy with work, but at the same time a little communication goes a long way.

We shouldn't forget that Frank is a forumner like all of us, that, on a voluntary basis, gave time of his own to this project, doing an awesome job regarding the dial and hands.

Second, it's not that our watches are handless waiting for the blued hands, and, if that was the case, still it would be Laco's responsability, not Frank's.

[frank_be]

Thanks Paulo,

I'm in contact with Mr Pfeiffer at the moment, so I think everything will accelerate again soon. I believe there was some misunderstanding about the vector files I've sent, but we will sort that out soon.

Greetings,
Frank

[brainless]

Hi Frank,

thank you for keeping to support our project - even when you are so busy with your company |>,



Volker

[Biggie_Robs]

We shouldn't forget that Frank is a forumner like all of us, that, on a voluntary basis, gave time of his own to this project, doing an awesome job regarding the dial and hands.

Second, it's not that our watches are handless waiting for the blued hands, and, if that was the case, still it would be Laco's responsability, not Frank's.

I'm sorry if I've been misunderstood or I have offended anyone. I didn't forget that Frank is a member of the forum, and I don't mean to be unappreciative of anyone's work. In fact, I am just the opposite; I appreciate Frank's work very much.

I was just inquiring if anyone knew if there was any kind of a timetable for when the hands would be ready. :oops: I felt like someone should know that information (over a month after Laco received the vector files from Frank), and I didn't think it was unreasonable to ask that question. Perhaps it was. I'll not make the mistake again.

[Paulo]

Deleted by the author.

[whifferdill]

Now it's my turn to be sorry, but if you don't want to be misunderstood you should check what you write.

Reviewing the sequence:



Your answer after this post is:



If you hadn't written the 2nd paragraph I would have kept silent or echoed the same worries about the lack of information (I had posted about that lack of information on the thread about the casebacks). But your 2nd paragraph aims straight to Frank, which is IMO quite unfair, reason for my post.

Again, I wouldn't have answered this 2nd post if it wasn't written in a victimised and devious manner, passing the message that I over-reacted to a simple and inocent inquiry, which isn't clearly the case.

Hi there - i think we should get this back on course re the Laco project rather than focus on what are, in the end, mild misunderstandings as a result of natural anxiousness to see the project move along and perhaps a difficulty in expressing what we really mean to say when communicating via a keyboard in a second ( or third! ) language!

I would please ask that members show both a little patience with the people driving this project and with fellow forum members - As far as I can tell, no one here is posting in a deliberately malicious manner so please give other posters the benefit of the doubt. If anyone becomes malicious or shows lack of courtesy to other posters, the moderating team will deal with it.

Thanks.

[Sandy]

Man, there sure are a lot of sensitive people in this post that love to parse every word!!!

So let me get to the point; what is the status of the hands?

Someone started this project and that person should be the point man with Laco to keep on top of them and to tell us the status. It won't help if any or all of us contact Laco directly; it will just aggravate Laco.

So please, will the main man get some information from Laco and let us know what is going on? When can we expect that the hands and the casebacks will start shipping?

P.S. Don't bother attacking me or my words; I don't care and I won't respond. I just want my hands and my caseback so I can move on.

[Crusader]

Someone started this project and that person should be the point man with Laco to keep on top of them and to tell us the status. It won't help if any or all of us contact Laco directly; it will just aggravate Laco.

So please, will the main man get some information from Laco and let us know what is going on? When can we expect that the hands and the casebacks will start shipping?

Not necessarily. ;-) The "hands project" is now in the hands of frank_be, and he just gave an update yesterday.

Thanks Paulo,

I'm in contact with Mr Pfeiffer at the moment, so I think everything will accelerate again soon. I believe there was some misunderstanding about the vector files I've sent, but we will sort that out soon.

Greetings,
Frank

I would like to add my voice to whifferdill's and request to put sensitivities behind ourselves and focus on the project. We are all watch-lovers and, for that matter, volunteers who devote our free time for the benefit of other watch-lovers. :-)

[garaventa]

if Mr. Pfeiffer gets useful vector files, he will start the ordering process for the bue hands.

So will try to catch him by phone tomorrow.

If I get new information from Mr. Pfeiffer you all will be informed.

Best Regards

garaventa

[bullitt731]

I emailed Mr Pfieffer this week regarding how the re-engraving of the case backs was coming. He said that he was waiting for two more case backs to show up before he would be able to have them all done.

Maybe he could send the hands out as well to those who want them with the case backs after he gets them done.

:think:

[yenfoolun]

this is good news then...
then i can bring the hands together to see my local watchmaker!

[Biggie_Robs]

I emailed Mr Pfieffer this week regarding how the re-engraving of the case backs was coming. He said that he was waiting for two more case backs to show up before he would be able to have them all done.

Maybe he could send the hands out as well to those who want them with the case backs after he gets them done.

:think:

That would be great, but do you know when the hands will be available?

[planetg]

according to Mr Pfieffer, it's not delivered to them yet. Thus gotta wait longer I guess

[Lencoth]

according to Mr Pfieffer, it's not delivered to them yet. Thus gotta wait longer I guess

Hi planetg,

does this mean that Laco have ordered the blue hands and are now waiting for the hands to be delivered?

Kind Regards.

[bullitt731]

That would be great, but do you know when the hands will be available?

I have no idea if they have been ordered, or what the actual status is.

I just thought I would relay the information I had to see if anyone more involved in the project thought it may be possible. :-!

[garaventa]

I have called Mr. Pfeiffer some minutes ago.

The blue hands are ordered!

Delivery time from the manufacturer to Laco will be 6-8 weeks.

So we will have to wait for detailed information a little bit longer.

But they will come to us in april I guess.

Best regards

Frank

[Lencoth]

I have called Mr. Pfeiffer some minutes ago.

The blue hands are ordered!

Delivery time from the manufacturer to Laco will be 6-8 weeks.


Thanks for the update Frank, good news!

[Biggie_Robs]

Thank you, Frank!

[bullitt731]

Thanks for all your work on this Frank.

[Biggie_Robs]

I have called Mr. Pfeiffer some minutes ago.

The blue hands are ordered!

Delivery time from the manufacturer to Laco will be 6-8 weeks.

So we will have to wait for detailed information a little bit longer.

But they will come to us in april I guess.

Best regards

Frank


It seems the blued hands and the newly engraved casebacks may be coming in to Laco at the same time. Has anyone asked Laco if they might be willing to swap the hands for those of us who sent our casebacks back? I know that, previously, the answer had been "no," but the timing (at least as I understand the current ETAs, which may or may not be accurate) seems like it might work out.

I don't want to bombard Laco with email queries, so I thought I would ask if anyone already has the info first. :thanks

[hotnerd]

Blue hands update:

Mr. Pfeiffer stated that order for blue hands were already placed. We know that it takes several weeks for delivery as stated in the beginning of the project.

So, we wait for the blue hands to be delivered to Laco. I think April-May timeframe.

Cheers,
Bhanu

[yenfoolun]

i'll wait for the blued hands....
then ask laco to send it together with my caseback!

[bullitt731]

i'll wait for the blued hands....
then ask laco to send it together with my caseback!


Same here +1.

[Sandy]

Same here +1.

I'm curious as to why you would want to get the hands and caseback at the same time? There is no savings in postage.

It sounds like the cases will be done weeks before the hands are ready so why wait?

[yenfoolun]

I'm curious as to why you would want to get the hands and caseback at the same time? There is no savings in postage.

It sounds like the cases will be done weeks before the hands are ready so why wait?

because
1. i not sitting at office waiting for postman all the time
2. i will go to my local watchmaker to change the hand anyhow, so let them change the caseback together is safer...
3. its already months we are waiting.... what is weeks compre to months? :-d

just personnal....

[inlanding]

Just a check-in...

Has anyone received notice as to a more precise timeframe when we will be able to transfer the funds to Laco to receive the blued hands?

Glen

[Biggie_Robs]

Blue hands update:

Mr. Pfeiffer stated that order for blue hands were already placed. We know that it takes several weeks for delivery as stated in the beginning of the project.

So, we wait for the blue hands to be delivered to Laco. I think April-May timeframe.

Cheers,
Bhanu

Well we're almost two weeks into June now, folks. Anyone have any new information regarding the blued hands project? :thanks

[LACO - Pfeiffer]

Blue hands are ready to be ordered now. Please take a look at our onlineshop: http://www.lacher-shop.de/e_shop/index.php?language=en
It is also possible to send in your watch and we will change the hands for you.
You will find this information at our onlineshop too.

with friendly regards, Peter Pfeiffer - LACO company

[Frode]

Exellent! :-!

[yenfoolun]

oh boy oh boy....

[Hary]

Awesome, finally :-! Mr. Pfeiffer, u got mail :-)

[yenfoolun]

just ordered....

oh boy oh boy.... YES!

[Biggie_Robs]

:-!Sweet!:-!

[fachiro1]

Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Paulo]

Looks great! :thanks :-!

[brainless]

Looks great - not only in pictures. b-)

Today i was in Pforzheim and picked up the hands and the reworked caseback: Cheerful whistles to Mr. Pfeiffer ! Well done, :-!



Volker ;-)

[Mescalito]

great! :-!

and now that our type B-project is finally finished, let's keep moving with our type A-project! (and this time the blued hands will already be included ;-))

[yenfoolun]

just got mine fixed today!

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o210/yenfoolun/laco%20wuc/DSC_0001-1.jpg

[Janne]

Laco should know that the Blueing on the seconds hand was painted over with black.
Well, it looks good, that is the main thing!

[daviswalker]

I never noticed that! I suppose we already have a black second hand. Janne are you going to replace all blue hands or leave the black second hand?

Dave

[Janne]

My Laco watches are still in Germany, I am waiting for the original 55mm to be serviced/restored.
I will instruct Laco to keep the "old", black seconds hand.
Many thanks, daviswalker, that fantastic idea never entered my (shrinking) brain!

[BRUCE]

Very nice Yenfoolun, thank you for the post. How does the complete watch look in the dark now? ..I'm just not sure if I know anybody local to do the job, that will not hurt my watch, so I may be sending mine to have the work done...I just hate to see it leave.

Bruce

[yenfoolun]

How does the complete watch look in the dark now? ..I'm just not sure if I know anybody local to do the job, that will not hurt my watch, so I may be sending mine to have the work done...I just hate to see it leave.

Bruce

the lume on the blued hands is also c3... so the color of lume with dial is matching both in dyalight and i in the dark....

let me take a lume short later ....

[yenfoolun]

there u go
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o210/yenfoolun/laco%20wuc/DSC_0222.jpg

in almost complete dark... the hands glow brighter than dial marker actually... which is good i think
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o210/yenfoolun/laco%20wuc/DSC_0223.jpg

its better than a steihart nav b
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o210/yenfoolun/laco%20wuc/DSC_0224.jpg

[Emperor759]

question:are any still available, if so what is end price to us?What numbers are left..if so is number 7 available. Thanks, Kent