what happened to this forum

[ilia]

I am curious. This Zenith forum used to have a several different postings a week and many responses. It looks like we have taken a back seat to the other Zenith forum.

What gives? Is it the change from the old watchuseek format to the new one? Have we lost fans of the Zenith watch? Or have we all grown old and lost interest in posting?

Just wondering.

ilia

[Hartmut Richter]

Having stumbled in on my day off - tomorrow is German reunification day and I am not going to Frankfurt for one day, coming back the next and driving up again the third! (apart from which it's my son's fourth birthday tomorrow) - I also noticed the lack of traffic while I have been away. There are two things I can say in reply to Ilia's post. First of all, I would not overrate the traffic volume on the other (presumably Timezone) forum - a large number of posts there seem to be mainly concerned with more mundane topics such as "how do I change the bracelet on my Zenith" or people saying hello after buying a new Zenith or queries about service. In short, nothing really outstanding, such as rare/vintage zeniths presented or unusual experiences. Secondly, I have said it before: advertising is everything!! In the old days, when I called up www.google.de (http://www.google.de) and entered "Zenith forum", right on top of the pile was the old forum. Nowadays, things haven't changed! It's still right there. WHAT'S IT DOING THERE - WE SHOULD BE GETTING A DIRECT LINK TO THE NEW FORUM!!!!!! In fourth place is timezone and right down the bottom of the first page is the link to the new forum. Who is likely to attract more traffic?!?!!

Apart from that, it is a little sad that there are so few interesting posts about vintages and unusual Zeniths. But then, maybe the new output makes serios watch collecters who participate in such fora shy away from the brand, even though these watches bring in revenue for Zenith from the glitz crowd. Maybe we ought to try and attract more women - the new ladies Zeniths do seem to be appealing to them as "unusual but nevertheless serious" watches, better than the small, two-hand-no-date Cartiers, Piagets & Co.

Just my 0.02$.

Hartmut Richter

[D N Ravenna]

I have nothing else to say. You two have said it well. I have had my salary scale back over the past several years, so it is hard to talk about my watches that have not changed over the years. Then again, I am pleased with my collection. :-!

If anybody has any suggestions, I'd love to hear hear it!

Cheers,

Dan

[TomHansen]

I am curious. This Zenith forum used to have a several different postings a week and many responses. It looks like we have taken a back seat to the other Zenith forum.

What gives? Is it the change from the old watchuseek format to the new one? Have we lost fans of the Zenith watch? Or have we all grown old and lost interest in posting?

Just wondering.

ilia

Dear All,

I have been a fairly active user a not-so-active user and a non-user in that sequence.

What I find hard to come to terms with is the clinging to the past and the lack of tolerance to the revitalised Zenith.

Whilst I am very fond of some of Zenith's past (my De Luca is my most frequently used watch and my Chronomaster T is closing in) I do not find it terribly hard to admit to Zenith's checkered past. Had it not been for the caliber 400 derivatives (or 3019 when it was launched) and some - definitely not all of their chronographs - being well designed and the very lovely cal 135 regrettably manufactured in far too few numbers to share I might not have been so inclined.

Could it have been a question of too many white coats and too few pragmatic marketeers in them good old days? Don't we tend to forget an endless number of bland designs and indifferent efforts being thrown into the market place at an alarming pace showing that perhaps the marque was out of touch with the market? Let us not forget that a couple of close-to-perishing crisis actually hit our friends in Le Locle.

I believe the De Luca is a splendid example of a great marque but a weak brand. Compared to its peer the very desirable Rolex Daytona Cosmograph it had the horological edge: 1/10 of a second stop watch (Rolex used the same movement but detuned the beat rate to match 1/8 second), date with the iconic position on the dial (Rolex skipped that useful feature) and a diving bezel (Rolex - no Sir) in addition to matching the tachymeter scale (on the dial - bezel on the Rolex). Design wise the case and the bracelet stacked up.

Yet the Daytona was far more successful with long waitlists and huge premiums being paid by keen followers whereas the superior Zenith gathered dust everywhere in spite of being produced in far fewer numbers and ended up being the NOS bargain of the century. Ironically Zenith also supplied imperative chronograph movements to the up and coming and every step of the way hip, cool must-have new luxury brand Panerai - and other, competing brands for that matter.

In recent years a very extrovert CEO has spared no effort in exploiting the good DNA and in pushing it to an eager world of new buyers. Now Zenith finally gets the apppraisal it deserves and it is roaming on the edge of the elite of Manufactures. I cannot but admire the way Zenith has been revitalised and - oh dear - I actually like many of their designs (if not their pricing but maybe I have been spoiled by Zenith watches being way cheaper than they should have been) and I find Zenith refreshingly bold, curious and innovative. The Lamborghini of watches?? It has become a new kid on the block at a very, very tender age. I wish I could make the same transitionB-)

I don't think we have become too old to submit posts on this forum (the other one is not too popular either) but I do believe we have taken an old guard approach to new Zenith not exactly motivating followers of the new desing to join. I have personally not found our approach particularly positive either and quite frankly lost interest - taking only an occasional glance hoping to avoid demise altogether.

If you wish to continue nursing the pre-unndefined time (probably around the time when Rainbow was discontinued) may I suggest that the forum is redubbed Zenith Vintage - that could remove the negative threads and create a more active forum - or - that one takes a more openminded approach to the new Zenith (or would they prefer Zenith Nouveau) stuff which could potentially generate fresh traffic and a more diverse forum. The US$ 1,000,000 question is whether you can teach an old dog new tricks.

Whatever course is chosen I wish the WUS Zenith forum the best of luck. There are many good reasons why the forum should persist the most important being an abundance of great knowledge and this town is definitely big enough for two major forums.

My US$ 0.02 (or mayby 0.03 based on quantity) an greetings from Singapore the capitol of watches including all things new.

[D N Ravenna]

I thank you for your post. It is a thought provoking one, namely because many of us were here prior to the new Zenith and really have had a hard time adjusting to the new style. Perhaps it is because we wish like Rolex, Zenith would not change its style.

It has given me something to think about, and I will do just that.

Warmest regards,

Dan

[ilia]

Dear All,

I have been a fairly active user a not-so-active user and a non-user in that sequence.

What I find hard to come to terms with is the clinging to the past and the lack of tolerance to the revitalised Zenith.

Whilst I am very fond of some of Zenith's past (my De Luca is my most frequently used watch and my Chronomaster T is closing in) I do not find it terribly hard to admit to Zenith's checkered past. Had it not been for the caliber 400 derivatives (or 3019 when it was launched) and some - definitely not all of their chronographs - being well designed and the very lovely cal 135 regrettably manufactured in far too few numbers to share I might not have been so inclined.

Could it have been a question of too many white coats and too few pragmatic marketeers in them good old days? Don't we tend to forget an endless number of bland designs and indifferent efforts being thrown into the market place at an alarming pace showing that perhaps the marque was out of touch with the market? Let us not forget that a couple of close-to-perishing crisis actually hit our friends in Le Locle.

I believe the De Luca is a splendid example of a great marque but a weak brand. Compared to its peer the very desirable Rolex Daytona Cosmograph it had the horological edge: 1/10 of a second stop watch (Rolex used the same movement but detuned the beat rate to match 1/8 second), date with the iconic position on the dial (Rolex skipped that useful feature) and a diving bezel (Rolex - no Sir) in addition to matching the tachymeter scale (on the dial - bezel on the Rolex). Design wise the case and the bracelet stacked up.

Yet the Daytona was far more successful with long waitlists and huge premiums being paid by keen followers whereas the superior Zenith gathered dust everywhere in spite of being produced in far fewer numbers and ended up being the NOS bargain of the century. Ironically Zenith also supplied imperative chronograph movements to the up and coming and every step of the way hip, cool must-have new luxury brand Panerai - and other, competing brands for that matter.

In recent years a very extrovert CEO has spared no effort in exploiting the good DNA and in pushing it to an eager world of new buyers. Now Zenith finally gets the apppraisal it deserves and it is roaming on the edge of the elite of Manufactures. I cannot but admire the way Zenith has been revitalised and - oh dear - I actually like many of their designs (if not their pricing but maybe I have been spoiled by Zenith watches being way cheaper than they should have been) and I find Zenith refreshingly bold, curious and innovative. The Lamborghini of watches?? It has become a new kid on the block at a very, very tender age. I wish I could make the same transitionB-)

I don't think we have become too old to submit posts on this forum (the other one is not too popular either) but I do believe we have taken an old guard approach to new Zenith not exactly motivating followers of the new desing to join. I have personally not found our approach particularly positive either and quite frankly lost interest - taking only an occasional glance hoping to avoid demise altogether.

If you wish to continue nursing the pre-unndefined time (probably around the time when Rainbow was discontinued) may I suggest that the forum is redubbed Zenith Vintage - that could remove the negative threads and create a more active forum - or - that one takes a more openminded approach to the new Zenith (or would they prefer Zenith Nouveau) stuff which could potentially generate fresh traffic and a more diverse forum. The US$ 1,000,000 question is whether you can teach an old dog new tricks.

Whatever course is chosen I wish the WUS Zenith forum the best of luck. There are many good reasons why the forum should persist the most important being an abundance of great knowledge and this town is definitely big enough for two major forums.

My US$ 0.02 (or mayby 0.03 based on quantity) an greetings from Singapore the capitol of watches including all things new.

I agree that I have a passion for the older/vintage design. I like what I like, and unfortunately only a few of the new designs really appeal to me.

The new Zenith has its place, the watches are selling and garner a much higher price then the older designs. Someone in marketing is doing their job. The new Zenith has created a market for women, which the old Zenith didn't do.

I think the new Zenith is trying to acknowledge the past with a few reissues and homages to the past. I applaud that, and I do the same for Omega. But look at Omega they still issue the vintage looking Speedmaster and have issued updated versions as well.

I think Tag has benefited much more then Zenith with better looking designs and functionality.

You are correct in the fact that some of the new designs have taken the knocks from us, and I have posted some of those myself. I apologize.

I think it would be nice to see Zenith support the forum either here or in Timezone. But they don't. We don't get a lot of information about inspiration or design. That would help. It is easier for me to talk about the vintage just because of the history.

Finally, I think the passion of owning a Zenith regardless of the era is missing. Hardly anyone in either forum posts about their new watches, the love, etc. Go to the purists and look at the Glashutte forum, J. Droz forum, etc. The owners love their watches, etc.

I like Dan love my vintage wathces, I have only picked up 2 zeniths in the last 2 years and sold many more (a few that I really regret selling) and the 2 recent acquisitons I have made are:

Glashutte Panomatic Lunar in blue and Pesuex 260 movement watch that I bought just to give me remaining 135 company. I did buy a Chinese chronograph that works and looks great, and for the 125- is a great watch and beats buying a knock off.

The Panmotic will be sold, my eyes are getting to old to see the hour dial clearly. But a beautiful watch.

My interests have shifted a little as well. Like Dan my job has changed, my pay has changed and my son is growing up. But I still love Zenith, search ebay everyday for them, check the site everyday, and check the competition as well.

I love my Zeniths, my vintage military 146 chronograph, my aging 135, my 1969 el primero student made at the horological school in france, 2 zenith pacifics, 2 zenith captains, a 3/4 sporto, and a movado pilot el primero. Yes, I am old schoolm but there are some new Zenith's I like and I think the newest line is much more horological minded then a fashion statement.

ilia

[k-k-k-kenny]

Hey Ilia and friends, all
I agree that we're all a bit inclined to knock the new designs and shudder at the prices - but then, there's so much about so many of the new designs to jeer at.
This said, Mrs k fell in love with the open queen of hearts in steel (glad it was without diamonds) white dial & black numbers when she saw it in Hong Kong earlier this year - and now she has one. In the metal it's pretty cute, and with the balance working away under the hole there's something to look at which is really no sillier than a skeleton or tourbillon or that inside-out half finished Breguet with the fabulous brass dial and microscopic hands. (Hardly a surprise to see THEM appearing second hand in LNIB condition, eh?)
And, whilst totally over the top, the black dialled Zenith tourbillon takes lots of styling cues from the nicest of the 135s. It's a cracker. And so IMHO is the girls' one with the diamonds shaped like a star. Sheesh - to think I was only 54 grand short of getting a black one when it appeared in the hands of a well known Malaysian dealer earlier this year.
There is another range of Zeniths that don't get much attention amongst the Elites and Port Royals that aren't too shabby at all. But love 'em enough to buy one? Dunno - we don't get to see them in the metal here in Oz.
Cheers
Ken