Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoultre?

Thread: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoultre?

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  1. #1
    Member rolexfantastic's Avatar
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    Question Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoultre?

    Hello

    I am a pocket watch enthusiast and i few quite a nice collection. Some for sale too.
    Anyway, i recently purchased this 14k quarter repeater and it was not cheap. My feeling of first glance said it was a Jules Jurgensen, but now i'm not so sure.

    Any help or guide to identify the manufacturer of this watch is highly appreciated !!

    The movement seem to be high grade with wolf teeth, and tried LeCoultre, Patek, Vacheron, Jules Jurgensen, Matile, Ed. Perregaux, Breguet, but no match. The curiosity is the twin bridge near the balance staff. The movement cover reads: "Repetition a Quarts", a 5 digit serial no., and several medals. The dial does not say anything. Under the dial it is writen something like Swiss, Brevet, and a no. but nothing helpful to identify the watch as i already tried all the sources of my convenience: catalogues, internet, collectors, friends, etc.

    Pictures:







    Thank you
    PFD
    Last edited by rolexfantastic; November 15th, 2012 at 20:04. Reason: Text error

  2. #2
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    The short answer is that it's a fairly common ebauche that was used by a wide range of higher-end companies. Being a ebauche, it was also used by countless small watchmakers doing one-offs. If the movement isn't signed anywhere, it's probably in the latter camp. The brevet number will give us a patent holder, which may help though. I find it odd that they would show competition medals without giving their name though. What hallmarks are on the inside caseback?
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

  3. #3
    Member rolexfantastic's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Quote Originally Posted by AbslomRob View Post
    The short answer is that it's a fairly common ebauche that was used by a wide range of higher-end companies. Being a ebauche, it was also used by countless small watchmakers doing one-offs. If the movement isn't signed anywhere, it's probably in the latter camp. The brevet number will give us a patent holder, which may help though. I find it odd that they would show competition medals without giving their name though. What hallmarks are on the inside caseback?
    I don't think this is a very simply ebauche as you can bet i checked everywhere for a similar and found none.
    The dial is guilloched and it has small sec at 6.
    The case only bears swiss gold hallmarks: Squirell, as per 14k Swiss gold.
    Of course the medals and movement made me consider is not a simply "mixed-up" watch.
    Can't tell the brevet no. because i would have to remove the dial again, and i can't say that would be definitely the 'key point' in this case.
    I'm pretty good in identifying movements but this one seems to give me a hard time.
    I also do complete restoration to any watch that worths attention.

    Thanks
    PFD

  4. #4
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Quote Originally Posted by rolexfantastic View Post
    I don't think this is a very simply ebauche as you can bet i checked everywhere for a similar and found none.
    I said it was a common ebauche, not a simple ebauche. Ebauches (near the end of the 19th century) were supplied to the finishers in pretty raw state. You can actually see one here: Interesting repeater movement your comments appreciated

    The fact that the bridge layout is so subtly different from the others out there is what makes me pretty certain it was finished by a low-volume watchmaker. Its not just the escape/fourth wheel cock that's different; the smoothly curved center bridge is unlike any of the ones I've seen on the net. The balance cock looks like ones I've seen on Invicta repeaters.
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

  5. #5
    Member rolexfantastic's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Definitely not an Invicta. Checked that already. From experience, Longines, Audemars, Beguelin, Centenial, and few others used twin bridges but i can't say for sure if this is the case for one of those. I also have a minute repeater & chrono, ultra rare by Audemars and it has a different bridge layout. Any other ideas ?

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    Member radger's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Very nice quality repeater.

    I have a watch which uses the twin bridge by Meylan and Guignard, these 'twin bridges' seem to be common
    amongst Locle watchmakers.

    Your watch might be signed beneath the winding or barrel bridge as in my example and others I have seen...

    Up close with an antique Locle watch.

  7. #7
    Member rolexfantastic's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Quote Originally Posted by radger View Post
    Very nice quality repeater.

    I have a watch which uses the twin bridge by Meylan and Guignard, these 'twin bridges' seem to be common
    amongst Locle watchmakers.

    Your watch might be signed beneath the winding or barrel bridge as in my example and others I have seen...

    Up close with an antique Locle watch.
    Thank you for the info. I actually checked your original post on Ed. Perregaux but never said my opinion on that, neither on other grat watches i saw here.

    For ex. E. Perregaux was an import name for Cross & Beguelin in US. So then again, Beguelin and twin bridge...

    Anyway, i will partially dismantle the watch today and see what i can come up with under the winding bridge.

    PFD

  8. #8
    Member radger's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Quote Originally Posted by rolexfantastic View Post
    Thank you for the info. I actually checked your original post on Ed. Perregaux but never said my opinion on that, neither on other grat watches i saw here.

    For ex. E. Perregaux was an import name for Cross & Beguelin in US. So then again, Beguelin and twin bridge...

    Anyway, i will partially dismantle the watch today and see what i can come up with under the winding bridge.

    PFD
    Thanks for the info, I wasn't aware that E.Perregaux was connected to Cross and Beguelin.

    Good luck in finding some info on your watch, keep us posted.
    Last edited by radger; November 16th, 2012 at 19:28. Reason: sp

  9. #9
    Member rolexfantastic's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Quote Originally Posted by radger View Post
    Thanks for the info, I wasn't aware that E.Perregaux was connected to Cross and Beguelin.

    Good luck in finding some info on your watch, keep us posted.
    I did not have yet the chance to dismantle the watch. Will get back soon.

  10. #10
    Member jedanzoom's Avatar
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    Re: Help in identifying this 14k Quarter Repeater High Grade Pocket Watch - Patek, Jurgensen, Lecoul

    Try with Le Phare.Rgds!
    “Thoughts are the shadows of our feelings - always darker, emptier and simpler.”

    Friedrich Nietzsche

    http://www.portalsatova.com/forum/

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