at what point does a franken become unacceptable?

[fireal]

whats your franken tolerance like ?


of course i would want a complete original , but i think i can tolerate new hands , relume job , new stap, maybe a recasing. Anything more than that would be



how abt u guys?

[Erik_H]

This comes down to definitions. Pocketwatches may have had a change to a new case in the past due to the fact that the old one was worn out, that is normal and fully acceptable. Old executions of marriage watches (pocket converted to wristwatch) is also perfectly fine, it becomes part of that particular watch's history. For vintage watches that are still in original condition today, I feel they should be left as they are. This means it is fine to do normal maintenance, servicing and cleaning, changing the odd mechanical component that has worn out, such as a mainspring. Apart from that, leave the dial and case as it is, if possible. In worst case if it can't be salvaged, look for a period correct replacement.

It becomes a franken when someone sets out to alter the identity of a watch and try to sell it off as something it is not. Like changing dial and try to make it look like a military watch, for example. Or combining components from completely different time periods in order to get something that may look good to the uninitiated.

[Ray MacDonald]

When it's purported to be something it's not - original, a converted pocket watch masquerading as a transitional watch, redial without comment, Third Reich paraphernalia. If it's made to fake out an unwary buyer it's unacceptable.

[AAWATCHES]

When it's purported to be something it's not - original, a converted pocket watch masquerading as a transitional watch, redial without comment, Third Reich paraphernalia. If it's made to fake out an unwary buyer it's unacceptable.

I agree, if a watch is masquerading as something it is not or made of different parts of different lines. I do have a question though hypothetical, you have a case then you get a correct dial and a correct movement so the watch is now complete and same as original. I do not feel that is a franken, however if sold, it should be disclosed that it is a totally rebuilt watch for the sake of honesty.

[Erik_H]

I do have a question though hypothetical, you have a case then you get a correct dial and a correct movement so the watch is now complete and same as original. I do not feel that is a franken, however if sold, it should be disclosed that it is a totally rebuilt watch for the sake of honesty.

I agree, and I honour you if you do so. But sadly this is not the case in many occasions. There are too many people switching parts and keeping quiet about what components their 'mint' or 'rare' watch may contain. The good rule is to buy (qualify) the seller before you buy the goods.

[Ray MacDonald]

I see nothing wrong with restoring a watch to its original condition either. Just don't sell it as an original from the factory. Frankenwatching is as much an intention as it is an actual piece of "watchcraft."

[ulackfocus]

I may be a bit more extreme in my definition. If it's not all original, it's a franken. I'd like to see a less derogatory term used for something that the hands were replaced with OEM factory pieces though. Franken is generally used to denote a watch that is pieced together to be passed off as an original. Maintenance items (like mainsprings which were frequently in need of replacement on vintage watches) can be replaced just like tires, brakes, oil & air filters on a classic car, but just like on a classic car you want all the numbers to match. Frame, engine and tranny should match as it did when the car came from the factory; case, dial, and movement should match on a watch as well.

[sherwoodschwartz]

i love my frankenwatch.

there, i said it.

not only do i love it, what's worse, i made it.

i had an old hamilton that took a 980 movement. the movement was damaged beyond repair. i didn't think to much about it. then i noticed a lovely 982m movement sans case being offered on the bay. i bought it for a song, and upon receipt immediately installed it in the watch. gorgeous. now i get to wear one of my all time favorite movements.

"that's repulsive" you say? ahh well. i'm never going to sell it. it's mine alone to admire.

"you're crazy. it never left the factory that way and is an affront to all human decency!" ok, now you're scaring me a little.

see, people who enjoy frankenwatches like me also like to argue with ourselves. great fun.

[AbslomRob]

"Completely Original" is an somewhat unattainable, theoretical state in that the best you can really hope is that all the serials match, and all the parts are at least visually consistent with what should have been there in the first place. I suppose you could "prove" originality by showing original reciepts and the details of all servicings the watch received, but then you run into the problem of verifying all that data.

So in my world, there's "Practical" originality (as above), and "Functional" originality (where all the main pieces and "aesthetic" items are or seem original, but things like springs, crystals and even gears or levers may have been replaced in order to keep the watch functioning.

Anything beyond that is at best a "restoration" (if the objective was to present the watch as it was originally intended to look), and at worst a franken (if the objective was to present the watch as something original).

[constellation90]

To me what I can't find acceptible is best fit parts in high end watches like Rolex.

Maybe if the part isn't made anymore, and you want it running. But otherwise it's not really a rolex anymore.