VINTAGE: your opinion - original or redial?

[ulackfocus]

This looks like a 2517, 2420, 2374/5 or 2499 because of the lug shape with holes. Do you think this could be an original dial?

[georges zaslavsky]

original dial because the original lume is present and the dial has some very minor spots showing its real age

[Joe K.]

Tricky call. I see some irregularities with the indices, but could be distortion from the crystal. The brushed finished on the dial leads me to believe this probably is original.

[hoipolloi]

Hi Dennis

I intended to say redial but then decided to leave it for you to decide.

I hate to see the A's with pointed tops like that.

That pointed top A usually goes with the printed Omega logo in ink in very old models.






Later, on dials with Gold logo, the A's have flat tops.







When refinishing old dials, the redialers have to leave the hour markers in places because they are fixed in there from the factory (they are not removable and they don't have feet).

[base615]

When refinishing old dials, the redialers have to leave the hour markers in places because they are fixed in there from the factory (they are not removable and they don't have feet).

I don't believe that to be true. I'm certainly no expert but I've always thought that they had feet that were soldered on the other side and a possible sign of a re-dial is glue on the back in place of the solder.

I once dropped a vintage Seamaster and an index marker was dislodged. A quick trip to the watchmaker and it was back in. I have to admit that I can't recall if it had a foot or not though.

[Francois Boucher]

I believe it is a redial. The early automatics had a range of different dials, but usually, the seconds ticks were either inserted in a track (early models), abutting the inside of a thin line circle, or were alone by themselves ("Constellation" style). It seems to me that only the redials show the ticks crossing a thin line… Maybe there was some technical reason for that?

The pictures of these early automatic models in Omega – A Journey Through Time, in the Automatic chapter, seems to support that opinion.

I believe it's a redial, but I also think it doesn't matter a bit if it's so hard to tell.

[Francois Boucher]

Nothwithstanding what I just wrote, I just found this model, identified as a Cal. 351 from 1952, sold on a Japanese vintage website…



…however, that dial also may have been restored… More pics here.

[hoipolloi]

I don't believe that to be true. I'm certainly no expert but I've always thought that they had feet that were soldered on the other side and a possible sign of a re-dial is glue on the back in place of the solder.

I once dropped a vintage Seamaster and an index marker was dislodged. A quick trip to the watchmaker and it was back in. I have to admit that I can't recall if it had a foot or not though.

Hi Base.

What you are talking about are "new dials", they look like these.




You can see the hour markers with two feet and they were rivetted into the dial. These markers are removable if needed.

But now, look at the back of an "old dial" which has fixed hour markers, these marker were attached in there permanently from the factory.





I've seen redialers refinish this type of dials.

First, they remove all the paint and clean the dial (and the markers, if needed)
Then they replate the markers to make them shiny again.
They apply a non stick coating film over the hour markers then refinish the dial.
After the new paint and the script are done and dry, they remove that non stick coating and you have a dial that looks brand new.
In this case, I think the redialer did cover the hour markers with the method above, that's why you still can see old lume on the markers.

[base615]

I stand corrected. Thanks for the examples mate, interesting stuff.

[ulackfocus]

I wondered about it because it seems in very good shape, especially when considering the era it's from and the usual condition a dial from that period would be in. I don't think I've ever seen a redialed two tone get the brushing correct (as Joe pointed out) nor the way the colors change at different angles as on the original versions (compare pic #1 and #2). Also, it's been mentioned that it could also be a replacement dial or even a redial from decades ago. There weren't computers when they did these dials so once a die wore out they made a new one - and not always identical to the original. I'll try to get better pics once I have it in my hands. Thanks guys!