How to help AVOID being scammed - Page 4
Like Tree50Likes

Thread: How to help AVOID being scammed

Page 4 of 7 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 68
  1. #31
    Member Arcticboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    309

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    Ask the seller to take two photos of the watch against the same background, on two different time settings that the seller gives him/her. A pretty safe way to know that there is a watch in the other end, at least...
    Thanks chrono24.com for the idea...
    Hidden Content
    Hidden Content Hidden Content

    1960 Certina DS 25-661
    1964 Omega Seamaster cal 267
    1970 Omega Speedmaster Professional 145.0022
    1970 Omega Speedmaster Professional MkII telestop 145.037
    2011 Home made ETA 2801-2 based

  2. #32
    Member Broker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    8,161

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcticboy View Post
    Ask the seller to take two photos of the watch against the same background, on two different time settings that the seller gives him/her. A pretty safe way to know that there is a watch in the other end, at least...
    Thanks chrono24.com for the idea...

    And also keep in mind that the seller may actually have the watch, yet has no intentions of ever sending it to you.

  3. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    43

    Re: ** warning ** scammers alert ** UPDATE

    Dolfan_noles paypal noles825@yahoo.com is a scammer - avoid

  4. #34
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    34

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    Can i make a suggestion to all here, i have read alot about the goings on here and other sites and it seems that there are many grubs amongst the good guys, as a collector i recently purchased from the states me being in Sydney i did my homework but come to think of it i dont think it was enough(hindsight is amazing) the deal went fine thankfully but what about asking for there passport and drivers licence picture i would have no problem sharing this info with a potential serious buyer this way they are confident that the seller is really who he says and you can verify where the watch is coming from and so on would this not be an easier way to deal, i know some will say privacy etc but if you have nothing to hide then whats the problem, would like to hear what you guys think too.

    Also this post is meant for watches of high value say $1000 plus not sure how it would work for smaller deals as another guy said earlier i think boots for a small deal sometimes its not worth the headache.

    gazoz
    Last edited by gazoz13; December 17th, 2009 at 13:22.

  5. #35
    Member Mr.Boots's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    989

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Iron View Post
    Would it be worth the headache if you lost $600 to a scammer?
    I believe that you two are misundersatanding my statement. My point is that under a certain dollar amount, it is not worth the headache for me as the seller. No way on this earth am I going to send anybody my passport or Driver's License pictures. You may be worried about who I am, but I have no idea who you are. If anybody should ask for pictures, it should be the person with the higher "meaningful" post count. That suggestion is right up there with "let me see your facebook page" idea. As if everybody has, or wants to have, a facebook page.

    Here is my point, once again. Part of being a solid community is using the strength of the community. This community extends outside WUS. When you want to buy or sell a watch, do so within the community. Anybody that you deal with as a newcomer should have solid credentials within the watch community:

    This means:

    You should be able to post a reference check on the appropriate forum, i.e. Dive Watch if you are considering a dive watch, Doxa if you are considering a Doxa, and so forth. I provide not only a list of references with their e-mail addresses, but always invite a new(to me) buyer to ask for a reference check on the many forums that I post on, i.e. MWR, EOT, Various WUS fora, TZ. In particular, the sales fora that I post on. If you check my screen name on TZSC, you'll see over three hundred sales postings. look at my posts and decide if I (and this goes for all sellers) am a regular poster who contributes more than a "nice watch" or "thumbs up" posts. If you are still concerned, ask my references what their screen names are on what forums and see how many and how knowledgable their posts are. Disreputable people and non-contributors will reveal themselves. Don't buy from someone who is a recent arrival if you want to be careful.

    It is easy enough on most forums, especially sales forums, to click on a seller's name and be able to call up all of his or her posts. If they have no posts, or very few sales and conversational posts, then do the research that I've mentioned here. If you are still so apprehensive that you want passport pictures, etc., than do us and yourself a favor and buy from an authorized dealer. You are not ready to be part of the community. In fact, if you are that new, with few posts of your own, the buyer should be more concerned about you rather than you about him.

    If you have no attention of becoming part of the community, than do the community a favor and don't buy or sell a watch here or on any other forum where you haven't established yourself. Buy from e-Bay, protect yourself with a paypal account and don't add to the rampant paranoia that is manifesting itself around here. The point of a solid, well-established online watch community is to build trust among members by having members build their reputations through participation and longevity.

    This the end of the message. The rest is my usual rant, so you don't have to read it.






    All of this stuff about passport pictures, DL pictures, reverse look-ups, Facebook, etc. is, IMHO, counter-productive to building a strong community. They add to the sense of paranoia of newbies and people who are using the sales forum as a watch flea market without contributing jackbleep to the community. I have to say that this is the most paranoid sales environment of any that I list on. There is no need for it, if you join and deal with established members of the community. After a point, suggestions like this are an insult to the hundreds, if not thousands, of good people selling and buying here.

    We have good mods, like Broker, who are zealous in their pursuit of scammers, because some people are so desparate to score the "Big Watch for Little Bucks" that they are stupid enough, gullible enough, that they don't pay attention to the obvious warning signs, and discard the basic tenet of the community: "Buy the Buyer." As I have stated, you may have to accept that you will have to pay "Fair Money for the Big Watch," but you will rest more easily while it is in transit and you will be contributing to the strength of the community.

    If I have criticized suggestions in the past, and I know that some hasve been upset with me, it is because I reject strategies that are based upon what I feel is distrust of a seller unless he is willing to share his most personal details with any bezel-kicking potential buyer who is considering buying a watch from me. To me, these strategies detract from the sense of community by making it more impersonal, and take away from the hard work of many others and I who have been collecting, buying, trading, and selling, and building our reputations with integrity. Just because you are new to the scene doesn't mean that I, or any other seller, should have to jump through impersonal identity hoops to sell you a watch. If I wanted to do that, I'd sell from my own website.

    Just remember, reputable known sellers have more than one inquiry about anything that he or she lists. Waiting around for several days while you dither and check this and that, when I or others have several buyers whom we have dealt with before, will wear thin. Be part of the community and have an idea, before you see this week's grail listed, of who the sellers are.

    Speaking for myself, if my references from the established watch community are not good enough for you unless you want pictures and fingerprints, etc., I'd rather that you not stress yourself by dealing with me. I would imagine that others feel as I do, but I'm a curmudgeon. Is that polite enough?
    Hidden Content


    Omega SMP 2589.30 Chrono
    Sub 5000T Professional
    Sub 5000T Caribbean
    Ball Muhle Glashutte SAR
    Ball COSC Diver
    Ball Fireman First Generation
    IWC Aquatimer
    Rolex GMT Master II Ceramic
    Rolex Sub Date
    Rolex Milgauss
    Ocean7 LM-2
    Ocean7 LM-4
    Ocean7 American
    Lum-Tec M38
    TimeFactors Italian LE
    Seiko 6105 IWW/Mk II Mod
    Prometheus Black, Yellow, and Blue Jellyfish. White and 2 PVD Baiji
    Prometheus Ocean Diver

    Time you enjoyed wasting is not wasted time. - TS Eliot

  6. #36
    Member Broker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    8,161

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    I understand both sides of the coin here. It's essentiallly up to the buyer and seller to work the deal out amongst themselves. This isn't a rule, it's just a tool.

  7. #37
    Member Mr.Boots's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    989

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    A picture is merely a picture and there are enough bogus licenses and even passport pictures out there that they are useless, picture alone. How would that picture be any more valid than my picture posted to the left under my screen name?

    I would rather have your references from a forum whereyou have over 700 posts, especially if selling or trading is involved, rather than a passport or license picture that has no valid verification unless the entire license or passport page were posted, and what fool would do that?

    Again, all of this stuff is being thought of so that people can buy or sell in safety without taking the time and effort to become a verified member of the watch community. If people don't want to take that time and give that effort, then buy from an AD or e-Bay.
    Last edited by Mr.Boots; December 18th, 2009 at 21:32.
    Hidden Content


    Omega SMP 2589.30 Chrono
    Sub 5000T Professional
    Sub 5000T Caribbean
    Ball Muhle Glashutte SAR
    Ball COSC Diver
    Ball Fireman First Generation
    IWC Aquatimer
    Rolex GMT Master II Ceramic
    Rolex Sub Date
    Rolex Milgauss
    Ocean7 LM-2
    Ocean7 LM-4
    Ocean7 American
    Lum-Tec M38
    TimeFactors Italian LE
    Seiko 6105 IWW/Mk II Mod
    Prometheus Black, Yellow, and Blue Jellyfish. White and 2 PVD Baiji
    Prometheus Ocean Diver

    Time you enjoyed wasting is not wasted time. - TS Eliot

  8. #38
    Member anonymousmoose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    8,326

    Re: ** warning ** scammers alert ** UPDATE

    Guys here is what I do when buying a watch. I've never sold one so I cant give advice there.

    a) ask if he has references.
    b) if he has a high feedback ebay account, send him a message via ebay. If he replies via ebay its a good thing (even if you are not buying via ebay).
    c) Ask him to set the watch to a specific time and date. Get him to email you the photos.
    d) if he has the original receipt, ask for a photo
    e) When you get his email, put the IP address headers into an IPLookup. If the emails do not originate from another area which he claims to be in, its not good (this may not work if the seller uses free email accounts like gmail, yahoo, hotmail etc)
    f) check his post count. Then go to his profile and look at his activity. If he has thousands of posts and they look legit, then its a good thing. If he has low posts and most are just random senseless replies & threads, then its not so good.
    g) when paying, ask for a paypal invoice that clearly states what you are getting. Get him to send a payment request first. Get seller to use works like Genuine, authentic etc. Fund from your credit card.

    Then its all up to gut feeling.

    I must say that I sometimes feel sorry for the sellers that I put them through my German interrogation; but so far all the people I bought my watches from have been happy to comply with my requests. Usually if a seller is legit he will understand why you are trying to be sure before buying. The last guy even asked for my references as a buyer, which was a good sign.

    I gotta admit, every time I buy a watch online my heart races and I think; 'could this seller be a smarter scammer then I a buyer'. Its all part of the experience.
    Last edited by anonymousmoose; December 27th, 2009 at 18:55.

  9. #39
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,122

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    There is no longer "Buyer Protection Policy" for transaction made outside of ebay. It is now called "Buyer Complaint Policy".

    Read here:

    https://cms.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/ma...20for%20Buyers.

    Here's the difference. You can still file a INR (item not received) dispute and escalate to a claim, but you are NOT guaranteed full recovery.

    "If PayPal makes a final decision in your favor, we will collect any available funds in the seller’s PayPal balance at that time. However, recovery is not guaranteed and is limited only to the amounts that PayPal can recover from the seller’s Account. Any amounts collected from the seller will be placed in your Account."

    So if seller closes account, empties account, whatever.....no refund!

    ALSO, No such thing as SNAD (significantly not as described) protection outside of ebay.

    "You may escalate the Dispute to a Claim within 20 days of the date you filed the Dispute. PayPal will make a final decision for some - but not all - Claims. You should not escalate a Dispute for Significantly Not as Described (SNAD) to a Claim because PayPal will not make a decision on a SNAD Claim under the PayPal Buyer Complaint Policy."

    So if seller ships wrong item, damaged item, or empty box, you are out of luck.

    How to protect yourself? Make sure to pay with Credit Card rather than Paypal funds. Paypal tries everything possible to deflect you from using a Credit Card because they eat the CC fee. You have to zero out your account balance first and then select Credit Card payment method, otherwise it automatically uses your existing paypal funds first. Using your credit card may provide back-up protection from your Credit Card company in the form of a chargeback.

    Also, when making payment, be sure to provide a good description of the item including the web link to the forum post. If you simply send money, paypal has no idea what it is for and then it becomes a 'he said, she said' issue. NEVER mark payment as a "Gift", as you will have NO protection at all, not even INR dispute.

    Anyway, we all agree that Paypal adds some distinct complications to the process, both for buyer and seller, but unfortunately it's the most convenient method of sending funds. Bank wire and Money Orders are fine, but require even more trust on the part of the buyer.
    Last edited by bmwfreak; January 1st, 2010 at 06:31.

  10. #40
    Member anonymousmoose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    8,326

    Re: How to help AVOID being scammed

    Ladies and Gentlemen, here is what I do when buying a watch. I've never sold one so I cant give advice there. A lot has already been covered in the original post yet I just thought I'd share what I myself do when buying online.

    a) ask if he has references.
    b) if he has a high feedback ebay account, send him a message via ebay. If he replies via ebay its a good thing (even if you are not buying via ebay).
    c) Ask him to set the watch to a specific time and date. Get him to email you the photos.
    d) if he has the original receipt, ask for a photo
    e) When you get his email, put the IP address headers into an IPLookup. If the emails do not originate from another area which he claims to be in, its not good (this may not work if the seller uses free email accounts like gmail, yahoo, hotmail etc)
    f) check his post count. Then go to his profile and look at his activity. If he has thousands of posts and they look legit, then its a good thing. If he has low posts and most are just random senseless replies & threads, then its not so good.
    g) when paying, ask for a paypal invoice that clearly states what you are getting. Get him to send a payment request first. Get seller to use works like Genuine, authentic etc. Fund from your credit card.

    In my last purchase the seller even emailed me from his company email address where he had a profile on the law firms website. He checked out to be a partner of the firm which inspired trust.

    Then its all up to gut feeling.

    I must say that I sometimes feel sorry for the sellers that I put them through my German interrogation; but so far all the people I bought my watches from have been happy to comply with my requests. Usually if a seller is legit he will understand why you are trying to be sure before buying. The last guy even asked for my references as a buyer, which was a good sign.

    I gotta admit, every time I buy a watch online my heart races and I think; 'could this seller be a smarter scammer then I a buyer'. Its all part of the experience.
    Last edited by anonymousmoose; January 6th, 2010 at 16:20.

Page 4 of 7 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts

    Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2