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Thread: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

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  1. #11
    Member mpalmer's Avatar
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    Flip em all and buy the Submariner. You'll feel better about the price point as time passes and you begin to bank money again. If will likely cost you far more in the long run to not buy it...
    "The stuff that dreams are made of…" - RGM '801 EE Motor Barrel'

  2. #12
    Member Ray916MN's Avatar
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    I've got a 5000T, 600T and pre-Synchron 300T as well as an MM300 and a 7.25" wrist. I prefer the MM300. The Doxa cushion case wears thick on my wrist and less comfortably than the MM300. I prefer the case style, finish and legibility of the MM300 too.

    I sent my MM300 a few years ago to CoServ for service and they sent it to Japan for service. Came back in short order and service was under $300 as I recollect. Runs fine and is accurate. I wouldn't worry about service.
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  3. #13
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray916MN View Post
    I've got a 5000T, 600T and pre-Synchron 300T as well as an MM300 and a 7.25" wrist. I prefer the MM300. The Doxa cushion case wears thick on my wrist and less comfortably than the MM300. I prefer the case style, finish and legibility of the MM300 too.

    I sent my MM300 a few years ago to CoServ for service and they sent it to Japan for service. Came back in short order and service was under $300 as I recollect. Runs fine and is accurate. I wouldn't worry about service.
    Thank you.


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  4. #14
    Member Vlciudoli's Avatar
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    I have Sub date and a few other cracking watches.

    My most recent purchase is the Doxa 1200 Caribbean.

    One of the things I like is that t has its own identity, it isn't trying to be a Sub.

    I've owned it a month and have worn it daily. Its great.

    But you should still buy the Sub...

    You''ll see from my collection below that when I bought the Sub it 'cured' me for several years.. I didn't need to feed my habit between 1999 and 2007...things changed then, and I was in the position to indulge myself, but ....had I not bought that Sub back in '99, I'm sure I'd have spent far more on lesser pieces, trying to convince myself.

    Oh, and in '99 the Sub was 2200 GBP.... adjusted for inflation now, that's cheap. Rolex will slip further from your grasp. Just do it.... and insure it.
    1990 Roamer 200m diver, Quartz
    1991 Tag Heuer GMT quartz
    1998 Omega Seamaster SMP SOLD
    1999 Rolex Submariner date. The one.
    2007 Omega Planet Ocean XL on rubber, SOLD in 2016
    2010 Seiko Monster Black Seiko Monster Orange, Strela mechanical
    2011 Skyland Avenger Blacksteel SOLD Rolex Daytona stainless ( for three days...) Rolex Explorer 2 bought from a friend in 2011, SOLD back to the same guy in 2013!
    2012 Rolex Explorer. Nice, understated watch for any occasion.
    2013 Omega Planet Ocean Liquidmetal Limited Edition Omega SMP , 1999 model Omega Planet Ocean 42mm 2500D on bracelet
    2014 Skagen ..why? Obris Morgan Predata, black as can be..Helberg CH6. Stainless with stainless bezel, SOLD Obris Morgan Predata, blasted finish Raven Deeptech, SOLD, Bombfrog SOLD
    2015 Steinhart Ocean Black. Unreliable.
    2016 Steinhart T500. Unreliable
    2017 Bulova Moonwatch, 2017. SOLD to a man in Estonia.Doxa 1200T Caribbean, Longines Legend Diver, date. Seiko Turtle, Pepsi/Rubber, Seiko Turtle PADI.

  5. #15
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    Okay, let me put my budget out there. The value of my watch collection. 1 Tudor Black Bay blue ETA, 1 Nomos Orion, 1 SKX007, 1 SKX009. I sold 1 Squale 20 atmos, sold 1 Seiko Sarb netting $600 total. To get to a SubC new from AD (not second hand, since that will vary) but using my AD quoted price on new out the door cash price. I would need to not only unload what I have in my collection, but also invest $1500. Which I could do. So, the Sub would be my only watch and I would keep it locked away as a safe queen until I reached financial freedom from paying off my mortgage (5 years left).

    My temptation is to flip the collection and put it on the mortgage, but I do enjoy watches.

    But, maybe since that is the consensus on every post I make, which is to just get the sub. Since I'm full willing to flip said collection, and lock the sub away. At least I'd have the SubC at its current price, and can then wear a that owned NOS SubC in 5 years time no worries. Then build a collection after that. I'm sure a Doxa or mm300 isn't going to spike in price either. But the Rolex could, easily.


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  6. #16
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    And as to my other threads. Just get the Sub. Don't get a Nomos Club, don't get a Rolex OP at 36mm, don't get an Explorer 1, definitely don't get a Seiko mm300 (I don't think I could stand the unadjusted movement at $2k), and just buy the Sub, lock it away, and quite reading the forums.


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  7. #17
    Member Ray916MN's Avatar
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    So aside from owning several Doxas and an MM300, I own four Subs. The Subs are nicer than the Doxas or MM300 in some ways of course and if this is what really floats your boat the question is why settle?

    The answer in your case seems to be, if you bought a Sub, you would be compelled to treat it as a safe queen. That is a good enough rationale to not buy a Sub in my book. Current production watches are meant to be worn. While current, they can be readily serviced and be cosmetically restored to as new condition with new case parts as opposed to refinishing. Spending so much money relative to your finances that you don't feel comfortable wearing the watch makes no sense to me. To be clear, I think there is an appropriate time and place for safe queens (I own some safe queens), but categorically, a new watch isn't the time and place in my book.

    Hope you enjoy whatever you decide to purchase.
    Vlciudoli and jalfreem like this.

  8. #18
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray916MN View Post
    So aside from owning several Doxas and an MM300, I own four Subs. The Subs are nicer than the Doxas or MM300 in some ways of course and if this is what really floats your boat the question is why settle?

    The answer in your case seems to be, if you bought a Sub, you would be compelled to treat it as a safe queen. That is a good enough rationale to not buy a Sub in my book. Current production watches are meant to be worn. While current, they can be readily serviced and be cosmetically restored to as new condition with new case parts as opposed to refinishing. Spending so much money relative to your finances that you don't feel comfortable wearing the watch makes no sense to me. To be clear, I think there is an appropriate time and place for safe queens (I own some safe queens), but categorically, a new watch isn't the time and place in my book.

    Hope you enjoy whatever you decide to purchase.
    I got into watches first, then after being in a career (funeral directing) and as a part owner of my firm, realized that, while I enjoy my vocation (I'm blessed to do what I do) I want to get away from work sometime. I want to retire, be financially free and independent. And be at that point when I can enjoy it. If you are an owner of your own business, you know the life is work and work is life is how it is for a while. My business partner is a 78 year funeral director who never had children and can't be happy unless he is working. I appreciate my career and the rewards of what it gives me, I also want to do other things while I'm young enough to do so. So, I'm not financially strapped by any means, it's that I'm fighting the fact that I actually can afford the purchase, yet that investing $7k in 20 years at 6% (average) compound interest is $22,000.

    We are disciplined to pay the mortgage off fast (5 years left) and that's without having to give up my watches. We don't take vacations and I don't have hobbies (work is my hobby) and the disease of watch appreciation. My spouse doesn't care if I own a Sub or my current collection, it's just that I feel I need to keep within that "collection value." As a budget constraint. I follow Mr Money Mustache, he would say no, but he also would say have fun along the way. Since my fun is watches, to the FI person it doesn't make since, but as my fun it does.

    So.... After such a long explanation, I guess the Doxa or mm300 would disappoint compared to when I do but a SubC and then would feel compelled to sell the other watches I collected along the way.


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  9. #19
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray916MN View Post
    So aside from owning several Doxas and an MM300, I own four Subs. The Subs are nicer than the Doxas or MM300 in some ways of course and if this is what really floats your boat the question is why settle?

    The answer in your case seems to be, if you bought a Sub, you would be compelled to treat it as a safe queen. That is a good enough rationale to not buy a Sub in my book. Current production watches are meant to be worn. While current, they can be readily serviced and be cosmetically restored to as new condition with new case parts as opposed to refinishing. Spending so much money relative to your finances that you don't feel comfortable wearing the watch makes no sense to me. To be clear, I think there is an appropriate time and place for safe queens (I own some safe queens), but categorically, a new watch isn't the time and place in my book.

    Hope you enjoy whatever you decide to purchase.
    I got into watches first, then after being in a career (funeral directing) and as a part owner of my firm, realized that, while I enjoy my vocation (I'm blessed to do what I do) I want to get away from work sometime. I want to retire, be financially free and independent. And be at that point when I can enjoy it. If you are an owner of your own business, you know the life is work and work is life is how it is for a while. My business partner is a 78 year funeral director who never had children and can't be happy unless he is working. I appreciate my career and the rewards of what it gives me, I also want to do other things while I'm young enough to do so. So, I'm not financially strapped by any means, it's that I'm fighting the fact that I actually can afford the purchase, yet that investing $7k in 20 years at 6% (average) compound interest is $22,000.

    We are disciplined to pay the mortgage off fast (5 years left) and that's without having to give up my watches. We don't take vacations and I don't have hobbies (work is my hobby) and the disease of watch appreciation. My spouse doesn't care if I own a Sub or my current collection, it's just that I feel I need to keep within that "collection value." As a budget constraint. I follow Mr Money Mustache, he would say no, but he also would say have fun along the way. Since my fun is watches, to the FI person it doesn't make since, but as my fun it does.

    So.... After such a long explanation, I guess the Doxa or mm300 would disappoint compared to when I do but a SubC and then would feel compelled to sell the other watches I collected along the way.


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  10. #20
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    Re: Doxa 1200T (seed planted by The Grey NATO) or a Seiko mm300.

    I even had a thread on a Nomos club neomatik vs Rolex OP. And a "most ethically made watch" or a Wartime watch that was the most quality for the price, it was a confusing thread that dealt mostly with which brand uses the most fair labor and sourced materials. The common answer is usually, just buy a Sub now, flip the collection of I have to, just get it now. And they won't be any cheaper than today. (Kind of like building a home, materials only cost more in the future.)

    I know this should be focused on my topic, but I guess, if I hold to the watch collecting philosophy that unless I own a Sub, I just have a bunch of watches (not a collection) then I should get a Sub since I can afford it (on paper). Even if I don't feel comfortable wearing it all the time, but for when I feel like it. I always think the worst will happen, which is poor thinking and a sign of lack of faith.

    If this is the case I know I could unload a Sub faster than a Doxa, or a mm300 or even my collection. I was hoping someone would say that the Doxa or mm300 beat the Rolex Submariner out of the water. I'm getting the impression that they don't. And won't make me happy.


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