Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

Thread: Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

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  1. #1
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    Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

    Hi guys,

    Can anyone suggest a great reliable japanese automatic movement that is at an affordable price point with the following specs:

    - Fits into a 40mm case
    - Is thin ish to ensure the watch build is less than 10mm high
    - Date at 6:00
    - At least 21 Jewels
    - Seconds hand has smooth sweep (with no stuttering issues like some movements i've read about caused by indirect drive train?)
    - Hacking optional

    Happy if the date window has to be at 3:00, if this widens my options significantly, but preference is 6:00.

    Thanks in advance for any constructive comments and help.

    Cheers,
    Christian

  2. #2
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    Re: Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSydneyStrapCo View Post
    Hi guys,

    Can anyone suggest a great reliable japanese automatic movement* that is at an affordable** price point with the following specs:

    - Fits into a 40mm case***
    - Is thin ish to ensure the watch build is less than 10mm high***
    - Date at 6:00
    - At least 21 Jewels
    - Seconds hand has smooth sweep (with no stuttering issues like some movements i've read about caused by indirect drive train?)****
    - Hacking optional

    Happy if the date window has to be at 3:00, if this widens my options significantly, but preference is 6:00.

    Thanks in advance for any constructive comments and help.

    Cheers,
    Christian
    *For some of us on f6, these words don't belong in the same sentence...and for many, when you string them together next to each other the result is an oxymoron...

    **Insufficiently defined term...something quantitative might help.

    ***Are you machining a case...or do you already have a case to use? External dimensions are not necessarily very helpful in movement selection.

    ****With sufficient magnification, even 28,800 bph "stutter" can be discerned.
    Direct...indirect drive train...huh... I believe you are talking about direct/indirect sweep seconds...which is not necessarily related to discerning "stutter". This is an issue of visual perception, rate (bph), backlash in the train and design with respect to maintaining sweep second hand position during each period (eg. via tension spring on the ss pinion).

    Perception of motion/stutter is a matter of "frame rate" (see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frame_rate) The cross-over point from "stutter" to "smooth" seems to be about 10-12 "frames" per second (in the watch world...36,000-43,200 bph). The list of candidates at 36,000 is small. And at this rate, most folks can discern movement...especially the longer the ss hand (as with any reasonable selection for a 40mm case).

    If you want a truly smooth ss hand...you'll have to go to tuning fork (none currently in production), 262 quartz Precisionist (Bulova = Citizen = Japanese...???), or one of the new ultra high frequency escapement systems (which are not yet available to mere mortals...and probably don't meet the "affordable" criterion by any R&D department's definition)...

    One question...why are you excluding Swiss...?

    Regards, BG

    I love naiveté
    "Education: the path from cocky ignorance to miserable uncertainty" (Mark Twain)
    Last edited by BenchGuy; April 7th, 2017 at 14:52.

  3. #3
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    Re: Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSydneyStrapCo View Post
    Hi guys,
    Can anyone suggest a great reliable japanese automatic movement . . .
    Setting aside the great and reliable qualifiers, it remains unclear if ANY uncased automatic movements produced in Japan would actually be available to you for purchase.

    If country of origin is important to you be sure to obtain a certificate of authenticity or other document irrefutably establishing the same as some entities are headquartered in one country and maintain production facilities in various other countries and there is great ambiguity arising from this.
    Follow the Tour. Hidden Content Hidden Content

  4. #4
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    Re: Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

    Quote Originally Posted by BenchGuy View Post

    One question...why are you excluding Swiss...?
    Mainly to keep the cost down.

  5. #5
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    Re: Looking for Japan Auto Movement w/ date at 6 and sweep sec hand

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSydneyStrapCo View Post
    Mainly to keep the cost down.
    Do warranty returns keep the costs down?

    Regards, BG

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