Feedback sought for Prototype Watch: EHF Pilot Mk.I

[slikmetalfab]

Pretty cool.

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[tangeld]

The black movement does it for me! Will these be available ever?
I must commend you on your effort as I am currently getting a watch prototyped at the moment and the effort sometimes outweighs the result (Not to say your watches look crud, actually the oposite!), so one big pat on the back for getting this far!

[akasnowmaaan]

The black movement and glossy case are phenomenal. I don't see those often, and that's a collection of striking details.

The front bothers me because it feels like a slightly updated Flieger. Mostly the hands. I'd rather see you continue the 'do something interesting' notion throughout the whole thing.

A good example is Defakto. They take a bog-standard ETA and through their minimalism make it stand out. It gets featured in design magazines and blogs because it brings something new to the table, has something to say.

Your case and movement seem to do that, but the dial is decent but unremarkable and the hands seem to actively work against it, and the 'Times New Roman' logo just plain annoys me. I think I see what you're trying to do - unite new and old, i.e. old-school hand-wound with modern black treatment, and carry it through on the front, but for some reason it just isn't working for me. The back I could stare at for days, the front wears out it's welcome.

If it had the aesthetic chops to match, say, a Nomos Club I'd be all over it.

Hope this is taken in the vein it's offered - an unvarnished and blunt opinion from a professional visual designer and watch nut.

[shawnehf]

Hi there,

Thanks! That's actually wonderful feedback. Actually do like the Nomos Club and Defakto designs. Very clean an appealing. It's quite clear we are a bunch of movement specialists and engineers; with nary a design bone in our bodies.

Anyway, we hope to launch a redesign of our dials soon. Some of our friends have suggested a design competition or even working with design professionals who are also watch enthusiasts. Our guys just came back from a used tool fair to set up our proper workshop, and hope to start work on it by mid May latest. If you don't mind, I would definitely like to pick your mind on some design tips (will PM you).

Cheers

Shawn

The black movement and glossy case are phenomenal. I don't see those often, and that's a collection of striking details.

The front bothers me because it feels like a slightly updated Flieger. Mostly the hands. I'd rather see you continue the 'do something interesting' notion throughout the whole thing.

A good example is Defakto. They take a bog-standard ETA and through their minimalism make it stand out. It gets featured in design magazines and blogs because it brings something new to the table, has something to say.

Your case and movement seem to do that, but the dial is decent but unremarkable and the hands seem to actively work against it, and the 'Times New Roman' logo just plain annoys me. I think I see what you're trying to do - unite new and old, i.e. old-school hand-wound with modern black treatment, and carry it through on the front, but for some reason it just isn't working for me. The back I could stare at for days, the front wears out it's welcome.

If it had the aesthetic chops to match, say, a Nomos Club I'd be all over it.

Hope this is taken in the vein it's offered - an unvarnished and blunt opinion from a professional visual designer and watch nut.

[GGN]

Hi,

Just saw this watch now and I have to say I really like it. I spend a lot of time playing the piano and so the case and dial reminds me of the 'piano black' finish you often see. Based on this front and dial, I think a highly polished/chrome finish movement might have suited it more?

However! The movement looks great - like a stealth watch. If you could get a front/dial that matches this back/movement then, as others have said, I think you would have something unique.

Best of luck with your watches and well done so far!

[Chris.C]

Hi Shawn -

Longtime lurker, registered JUST to reply to your post.

1. The watch, and your entire new venture, is awesome. I've visited the website and read all of your blog entries.

2. I am an engineer also, and fully appreciate the amount of work you've done on the case, strap, buckles, movement, dial, etc. etc. etc.

3. I am a Sinn lover, and my single design mantra is "Less Ink". I also like Bill Gates' quote about the "War for Simplicity". It would be well worth your time to purchase all four books by Edward Tufte related to delivering information in a clear manner. That said....

4. I somewhat dislike the "3" and "9" because they are in a different sized font. I STRONGLY dislike the "12" because it is in a THIRD size of font. The 3 and 4 I could live with, but the 12 MUST also be that larger font. If you cannot "fit" the 12 using the same font size as the 3 and 4, then reduce the 3 and 4.

5. I would appreciate a slightly more "beefy" winding crown. A little more "tool watch", a little more depth, a little less dome on the end surface. Also... It appears that I can see shaft in one of the pictures... will this be a screw down crown? I hope so.

6. Stick with JUST the "EFH", no lettering underneath. Less Ink, remember!

Still, these are small opinions, and design preferences vary from person to person. I don't see anything catastrophic, and everything you have done is beautiful. GREAT LUCK with your new venture.

[shawnehf]

Hi GGN

Thanks for the support!

Our guys are also quite divided re the Mk ONE. Some of us love the basic aesthetics, while others find the black and white too flat. That said, we mucked around in the workshop and put in gold hands (hr, min and sec) and gold plated the bridges (though main plate was in contrasting black rhodium) as well. We found that the gold accent helped bring an additional layer of complexity to the visual aesthetics.. though I think there continues to be room for improvement!

Cheers

Shawn & the EHF Team

Hi,

Just saw this watch now and I have to say I really like it. I spend a lot of time playing the piano and so the case and dial reminds me of the 'piano black' finish you often see. Based on this front and dial, I think a highly polished/chrome finish movement might have suited it more?

However! The movement looks great - like a stealth watch. If you could get a front/dial that matches this back/movement then, as others have said, I think you would have something unique.

Best of luck with your watches and well done so far!

[shawnehf]

Hi Chris,

Thanks for the note! Appreciate you signing on just to give comments and for visiting our website (which I just revamped again yesterday - part and parcel of our early stages of growth and finding our feet!).

Haha... I agree with you re the war for simplicity. That said, I half suspect we need to get bogged down loads of stuff before deciding what to cull and what to keep towards achieving succinctness... I don't think we can really get that 100% right all the time, but definitely reminders to remain true to what we believe in help keep us in check.

Indeed re the personal preferences.. that said, user ergonomics is quite important - and I do agree that a larger crown makes would make for easier winding. As for the dial design, we have a love-hate camp amongst us guys at EHF on the Mk ONE as mentioned in my earlier response to GGN.... That said, I was thinking that giving collectors a choice of 3 different dial designs for a fixed case may help alleviate some of that problem.. which is something we are trying to experiment with with our Personalisee project. Think fixed case/movement, and 3-5 choices for dials, hands, plating for movement etc etc

Not sure if you have also visited our Facebook site. Aside from the educational stuff, we try to post interesting snippets / images related to watch making history, interesting watches (e.g. the Bulova Accutron was significant as the first electric tuning fork watch) etc etc. And very happy to have your comments/thoughts posted there as well.. makes for much easier and dynamic to-and-fro conversation.

Cheers

Shawn & the EHF Team

Hi Shawn -

Longtime lurker, registered JUST to reply to your post.

1. The watch, and your entire new venture, is awesome. I've visited the website and read all of your blog entries.

2. I am an engineer also, and fully appreciate the amount of work you've done on the case, strap, buckles, movement, dial, etc. etc. etc.

3. I am a Sinn lover, and my single design mantra is "Less Ink". I also like Bill Gates' quote about the "War for Simplicity". It would be well worth your time to purchase all four books by Edward Tufte related to delivering information in a clear manner. That said....

4. I somewhat dislike the "3" and "9" because they are in a different sized font. I STRONGLY dislike the "12" because it is in a THIRD size of font. The 3 and 4 I could live with, but the 12 MUST also be that larger font. If you cannot "fit" the 12 using the same font size as the 3 and 4, then reduce the 3 and 4.

5. I would appreciate a slightly more "beefy" winding crown. A little more "tool watch", a little more depth, a little less dome on the end surface. Also... It appears that I can see shaft in one of the pictures... will this be a screw down crown? I hope so.

6. Stick with JUST the "EFH", no lettering underneath. Less Ink, remember!

Still, these are small opinions, and design preferences vary from person to person. I don't see anything catastrophic, and everything you have done is beautiful. GREAT LUCK with your new venture.

[SillentWolf]

I follow the EHF site for a couple of months now, and i'm curious about that ... personalisee project.
Not to mention the prices of your watches.

I'm a great fan of small watch company's and independent watchmakers (such as: EHF, Fraser TimePieces, Lum-Tec etc.), who doesn't want to rip a long of your chest with there prices .. but
still be different, then many of the other 600+ brands on the marked today. I always say on forums and Twitter when i talk about watches; new watchmakers must bring something new to the bank. Something that will
put them apart from the rest of the flock. Frasier tries that on design, others (such as yourself), on the movements. You must be willing to give something watch lovers don't have. Because i think ... nobody wants the 400st Rolex clone watch, that
many brands putting on the marked. At least i don't. I want something special, for a nice price. And i don't mean for Rolex or Panerai prices.

So you can see that i'm curious about new brands. Hopefully EHF will do that. And if i believe the website; you will. ;)

[shawnehf]

Hi SilentWolf,

Thanks for keeping us in mind!

Great that you are asking about our Personalisee service. It sort of came about as we were exploring how best we can value add through our products and services.... Like you mentioned, its very competitive out there and it is important to bring something new to the table. And to add, it must also be accessible to the bulk of the watch loving population...

So, given that we have in house WOSTEP certified watch makers with tonnes of experience between them; and also our production process can handle small production runs.... it was natural for us to offer customization services... Of course, we could build a watch from scratch or near scratch.. Actually, we are currently working on a commissioned project that will see us using a vintage movement. We were very luck to get our hands on some of these movements... they are new old stock; and judging by the mechanism, about 80-100 years old... anyway, we will be working with the owner on building up the case, hands and dials from grounds up.. so, that's one end of the spectrum... but we figured not everyone can afford to burn a bank to do something like that or invest the time required to work with us to build their dream watch... (it was a whole new education process for the owner as well!) ... so we figured that if we worked around parts (especially the ones that require high MOQ or require really heavy machinery to create e.g. cases) that we have in stock or ease of access to, we could significantly lower the cost of a personalized watch.... and deliver a "packaged customization" option that is both affordable and easy (note the investment in time for a truly customized watch) for most consumers to handle... So that pretty much wraps up why and how we came up with the Personalisee Service...

We also just uploaded a post on our FB site on what we do that makes us different from other brands... will PM you the link and also the pricing that you asked for...

Please keep your questions coming... its always wonderful to have engaged participants even if they do not end up purchasing EHF watches... the questions keep us on our feet and we also learn more in the process...

Cheers

Shawn & the EHF Team

I follow the EHF site for a couple of months now, and i'm curious about that ... personalisee project.
Not to mention the prices of your watches.

I'm a great fan of small watch company's and independent watchmakers (such as: EHF, Fraser TimePieces, Lum-Tec etc.), who doesn't want to rip a long of your chest with there prices .. but
still be different, then many of the other 600+ brands on the marked today. I always say on forums and Twitter when i talk about watches; new watchmakers must bring something new to the bank. Something that will
put them apart from the rest of the flock. Frasier tries that on design, others (such as yourself), on the movements. You must be willing to give something watch lovers don't have. Because i think ... nobody wants the 400st Rolex clone watch, that
many brands putting on the marked. At least i don't. I want something special, for a nice price. And i don't mean for Rolex or Panerai prices.

So you can see that i'm curious about new brands. Hopefully EHF will do that. And if i believe the website; you will. ;)