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  1. #71
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Right, yeah, okay, you too! Whatever that means.
    Buellrider likes this.

  2. #72
    Moderator at Large stuffler,mike's Avatar
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Quote Originally Posted by macchina View Post
    Two things:
    I was considering a Damasko for an outdoor watch and though a lot of the marks on the OP's watch wouldn't have been found by me, his report of their customer service really makes me want to avoid this brand!

    Second, I've seen "ice hardening" mentioned here a lot and wanted to chime in that this is an extremely common process as a step in hardening stainless steel. I'll grant Damasko that a lot of watch makes don't harden their steel (it's usually left in the annealed state), but millions or billions of stainless items are hardened every day and an ice bath quench is nothing remotely unique. It sounds to me they may be 100% finishing the bracelet components before hardening (it's much easier on tooling when the steel is soft) and the marks may come from bulk handling of the components.

    To brag about an ice bath quench in a stainless hardening proccess is like bragging about using primer before you painted a house. A lot of people do it, not many people brag about it!
    Two things as well: Why posting in the wrong thread ? This one here is about Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth and not about ice-hardening processes or patents Damasko holds.

    Second, Damasko was smart to patent their choice of steel alloy for all watch case applications. They use Cronidur 30 (X30CrMoN15 1). They did not invent this steel, nor did they develop its ice hardening process. But they were brilliant in finding novelty in order to secure a patent. Here is their explanation of novelty from their US patent:

    "these materials have heretofore been regarded by experts as unsuitable for the manufacture of wrist watches, due to the fact that such steels are highly magnetizable, especially by external magnetic fields, so that they function as permanent magnets whose magnetic field strongly impairs the highly sensitive clockwork of a wrist watch. The invention is based on the realization that the aforementioned hardenable steel surprisingly is suitable for wrist watch cases, and especially if in the interior of the case a ring or plate enclosing the clockwork is made of a diamagnetic metal."
    whineboy likes this.
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  3. #73
    Avo
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    I find it absurd that this observation (you can use magnetic shielding to shield a magnet!) is deemed worthy of a patent.
    Sharper Image moonphase, Ronda 708 quartz (my only watch for 20+ years)
    Citizen BM8242-08E Ecodrive, black dial, gold-tone case
    Citizen AP1042-03A Ecodrive moonphase, white dial, gold-tone case
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    Christopher Ward C5 Aviator Mark I, black dial, ETA 2824
    Chinese Mechanical Forum 2011 project watch, moonphase, Sea-Gull ST25
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    Aevig Huldra, orange dial, Miyota 9015
    Makara Hawksbill Sea Turtle, bronze case, maroon dial, Seiko NH35A
    Timex Weekender, Indiglo cream dial
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    Grails: RGM 801 A, GO PanoMaticLunar, ALS Lange 1 moonphase


  4. #74
    Member Vig2000's Avatar
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Quote Originally Posted by Avo View Post
    I find it absurd that this observation (you can use magnetic shielding to shield a magnet!) is deemed worthy of a patent.
    All's fair in love and capitalism.

  5. #75
    Member Iandk's Avatar
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Well, given that in several hundreds of years of watchmaking, nobody had used the concept to protect the movement from a magnetized case, so that you could use more exotic alloys such as X30CrMoN15 for the case...
    whineboy likes this.

  6. #76
    Avo
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Rolex used exactly the same sort of shield in the Milgauss in 1958. So the shield is not new. The only new thing is noticing that, if you shield against all magnetic fields (like the Milgauss), that will include any fields produced by the case.

    Really doesn't seem worth a patent to me, but the US Patent Office disagrees.
    Last edited by Avo; 13 Hours Ago at 07:22.
    Sharper Image moonphase, Ronda 708 quartz (my only watch for 20+ years)
    Citizen BM8242-08E Ecodrive, black dial, gold-tone case
    Citizen AP1042-03A Ecodrive moonphase, white dial, gold-tone case
    Bertucci A-2T, black PVD titanium case, electroluminescent gray dial, Japan quartz
    Sartego Ocean Master SPA27, yellow dial, Miyota 8215
    Christopher Ward C5 Aviator Mark I, black dial, ETA 2824
    Chinese Mechanical Forum 2011 project watch, moonphase, Sea-Gull ST25
    Casio G-Shock AWGM100B-1A, analog solar atomic
    Kadloo Scubamarine, black dial, ETA 2824
    Aevig Huldra, orange dial, Miyota 9015
    Makara Hawksbill Sea Turtle, bronze case, maroon dial, Seiko NH35A
    Timex Weekender, Indiglo cream dial
    Rodina R005 small seconds, white dial, Sea-Gull ST1701
    Ginault Ocean-Rover, black dial, Ginault 7275
    Grails: RGM 801 A, GO PanoMaticLunar, ALS Lange 1 moonphase


  7. #77
    Member MrDagon007's Avatar
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Quote Originally Posted by Avo View Post
    Rolex used exactly the same sort of shield in the Milgauss in 1958. So the shield is not new. The only new thing is noticing that, if you shield against all magnetic fields (like the Milgauss), that will include any fields produced by the case.

    Really doesn't seem worth a patent to me, but the US Patent Office disagrees.
    New was using a shield with a metal that was considered not suitable for watches. But I agree that it seems like a trivial innovation.
    Anyway isn't it expired now?
    As an aside I have a Böker knife with cronidur steel blade. In that use case it is a reasonably good (hard and hard wearing) blade steel though not the most extreme among knives, what is interesting though is that it is very stainless if I remember well, and hence it is a bit puzzling that it is not used for the dive watch.

  8. #78
    Member Iandk's Avatar
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    Re: Damasko and Authorized Dealer Experience, Refund Policy, Seeking Truth

    Yeah, it's expired anyways, so it's a moot point now.

    Cronidur 30 is one of the more stainless hardenable steels, but it's still not as resistant as 316L.

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