Brocot Watches

Thread: Brocot Watches

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  1. #1
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    Question Brocot Watches

    Hello,
    I am doing research on Brocot for university, but cannot seem to find any information on the internet about the vintage watch brand. I would really appreciate it if you could tell me any information you know in regards to the Brocot brand, as in the target audience (what type of people wore Brocot at the time it was popular), how popular were the wristwatches, how was Brocot different from the other brands or any other relevant information.

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Kind Regards,
    Milana L.

  2. #2
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    There were two famous clockmakers by the name of Brocot, and they are often confused

    Louis-Gabriel Brocot was a well-known Parisian clockmaker, known to have been working between 1820 and 1850. He is most well known for his pin-pallet escapement, which was widely used, often as a visible escapement in French black marble clocks.

    Achille Brocot (1817 - 74) was the eldest son of Louis-Gabriel, and he also carried on business in Paris. His most well known improvement to clocks was the adjustable spring pendulum suspension, which enabled the rate of a pendulum clock to be adjusted from the front of the dial. He also designed an effective perpetual calendar mechanism.


    The Brocot Pin Pallet Escapement

    This escapement was widely used, as a highly decorative, yet easily made addition to the ornamental black marble cased clocks so popular from 1850 onwards. The standard French roulant movement was modified to bring the escapement to the front of the dial, occupying the position just below 12 o'clock. The pallets in this escapement are cylindrical jewel pins, usually deep red in colour, made from agate or cornelian. The pallet arms and escape wheel bridge are formed to ornamental shapes, and highly polished.
    The working faces of the pallet pins are cut away to a D-shape - the teeth of the escape wheel fall on the curved surface of the D to provide impulse.
    Unfortunately, many of the clocks with this escapement have been badly restored - one often sees the original jewel pins replaced by steel, and the pallets replaced the wrong way round, so that the escape wheel teeth fall on the flat surfaces of the pins.


    The Brocot Pendulum Suspension

    There is some argument as which of the Brocots actually invented this suspension.
    Louis-Gabriel actually took out a patent No. 7880 in 1840) which seems to indicate that the original idea was his, but the improved version designed by Achille Brocot is apparently the one adopted by his father, and both are known to have supplied the improved form of suspension to many other clockmakers, with whom it soon became extremely popular.

    The illustration shows that the suspension spring is held in the normal way by a pin at the upper end, but beneath this pin there is a sliding block, slit to embrace the spring. This block can be raised or lowered by a fine screw, which in turn is rotated by a rudimentary bevel gear fixed to an arbor which protrudes through the dial of the clock. The arbor has a square on the end for use with a watch key - in practice, the the keys supplied with these clocks were usually double-ended, to fit both the mainspring arbors and the Brocot adjuster - unfortunately, many of these original keys have now been lost.

    Both the Brocot Visible Escapement and the Pendulum Suspension were widely copied, particularly in America, and these versions are usually much inferior in both materials and finish.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    Brocot, Archille and J.B. Delettrez of Paris
    This partnership was working at Rue Charlot, Paris. in 1850. In 1851 they exhibited one clock of public prosecutor's office. Delettres took over the partnership in 1870 and the patents held by the partnership were given up to Thieble. Later Ferron Lossow succeeded Delettrez and ran the business from Rue Commines, Paris
    AB (mit Stern im Oval) Louis Achile Brocot Paris, Frankreich; um 1850-1889
    AB (im Stern) Achille Brocot Paris, Frankreich; ca. 1850-1889
    thanks to mikrolisk
    also a look here:http://www.google.it/url?sa=t&rct=j&...zRzSkCQ2QSXIuw

    regards enrico
    Last edited by eri231; May 26th, 2013 at 16:01.

  3. #3
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    Well, in 1994 Eric Loth filed a US trademark application for Brocot Propte, but looks like they never followed up on the registration, and it was canceled in 2003. They also filed a Swiss trademark registration, which was transfered to "Onion Star Company Anstalt in Liechtenstein in 1999.

    That's the modern stuff. Historically, the name comes from Louis-Gabriel Brocot, who invented the Brocot Escapement (an escapement is the part of the watch or clock that transfers the power of the mainspring into the balance in a controlled manner). Brocot is linked to Roskopff and the development of the pin pallet escapement (a fixture of low-cost watches the world over).

    There are no other Brocot trademarks that I can find off hand, so I suspect the "modern" brocot watches are probably just "typical" watches using an historically significant name to give themselves some semblance of cachet.
    Last edited by AbslomRob; May 26th, 2013 at 20:50.
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

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  5. #4
    Member joeuk's Avatar
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    Here is a pdf on the clocks http://www.nawcc69.org/pdf/Brocots_v3.pdf but like others have mentioned can only find the clock side of the name and nothing on watches.

  6. #5
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    Quote Originally Posted by eri231 View Post
    There were two famous clockmakers by the name of Brocot, and they are often confused

    Louis-Gabriel Brocot was a well-known Parisian clockmaker, known to have been working between 1820 and 1850. He is most well known for his pin-pallet escapement, which was widely used, often as a visible escapement in French black marble clocks.

    Achille Brocot (1817 - 74) was the eldest son of Louis-Gabriel, and he also carried on business in Paris. His most well known improvement to clocks was the adjustable spring pendulum suspension, which enabled the rate of a pendulum clock to be adjusted from the front of the dial. He also designed an effective perpetual calendar mechanism.


    The Brocot Pin Pallet Escapement

    This escapement was widely used, as a highly decorative, yet easily made addition to the ornamental black marble cased clocks so popular from 1850 onwards. The standard French roulant movement was modified to bring the escapement to the front of the dial, occupying the position just below 12 o'clock. The pallets in this escapement are cylindrical jewel pins, usually deep red in colour, made from agate or cornelian. The pallet arms and escape wheel bridge are formed to ornamental shapes, and highly polished.
    The working faces of the pallet pins are cut away to a D-shape - the teeth of the escape wheel fall on the curved surface of the D to provide impulse.
    Unfortunately, many of the clocks with this escapement have been badly restored - one often sees the original jewel pins replaced by steel, and the pallets replaced the wrong way round, so that the escape wheel teeth fall on the flat surfaces of the pins.


    The Brocot Pendulum Suspension

    There is some argument as which of the Brocots actually invented this suspension.
    Louis-Gabriel actually took out a patent No. 7880 in 1840) which seems to indicate that the original idea was his, but the improved version designed by Achille Brocot is apparently the one adopted by his father, and both are known to have supplied the improved form of suspension to many other clockmakers, with whom it soon became extremely popular.

    The illustration shows that the suspension spring is held in the normal way by a pin at the upper end, but beneath this pin there is a sliding block, slit to embrace the spring. This block can be raised or lowered by a fine screw, which in turn is rotated by a rudimentary bevel gear fixed to an arbor which protrudes through the dial of the clock. The arbor has a square on the end for use with a watch key - in practice, the the keys supplied with these clocks were usually double-ended, to fit both the mainspring arbors and the Brocot adjuster - unfortunately, many of these original keys have now been lost.

    Both the Brocot Visible Escapement and the Pendulum Suspension were widely copied, particularly in America, and these versions are usually much inferior in both materials and finish.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    Brocot, Archille and J.B. Delettrez of Paris
    This partnership was working at Rue Charlot, Paris. in 1850. In 1851 they exhibited one clock of public prosecutor's office. Delettres took over the partnership in 1870 and the patents held by the partnership were given up to Thieble. Later Ferron Lossow succeeded Delettrez and ran the business from Rue Commines, Paris
    AB (mit Stern im Oval) Louis Achile Brocot Paris, Frankreich; um 1850-1889
    AB (im Stern) Achille Brocot Paris, Frankreich; ca. 1850-1889
    thanks to mikrolisk
    also a look here:http://www.google.it/url?sa=t&rct=j&...zRzSkCQ2QSXIuw

    regards enrico
    Enrico
    I am impressed
    I searched my records and came up with nothing.
    Thats a lot you dug up.

    For wristwatches, really I found nothing
    Regards
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

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    "Owning a vintage watch is great, understanding where it sits in Horology is magnificent"
    and
    "By Teaching Others, We Teach Ourselves"
    Adam

  7. #6
    Member Sparcster's Avatar
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    Cant add much.... some pics of 'Brocot Watches' may help...



    Brocot 1826 Swiss Made Seconds Sub Dial Chronograph Designer Dial Mens Watch | eBay

    and..



    Vintage BROCOT D2182 Sapphire Mother of Pearl Dial Swiss Made Men Quartz Watch | eBay


    But as Rob suggests... I doubt these modern watches have any real connections to the historical company!
    A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away...

    Antoine de Saint-Exupery

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  8. #7
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    Re: Brocot Watches

    Thank you very much for your posts and opinions they are very helpful! I am still searching for more information on Brocot watches, so please if there is any other information feel free to post further on this thread.

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