Cyma on the bench
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Thread: Cyma on the bench

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  1. #1
    Member JackW's Avatar
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    Cyma on the bench

    About a month ago I purchased what is in my opinion (IMHO?) is a nice looking and not too common styled sterling cushion cased Cyma. Although the auction was not listing the size of the movement, I had thought it might be the slightly larger 15 jewel in the Cyma/Tavannes stable. Nope it is the cal. 030 at 10.5 ligne. Sellers images showed a few problems from the get go, but nothing I thought that would be too much of a challenge, yet something that would also help push my skills in the repair arena.

    Movement as it was advertised...

    Name:  mvt_n_case.jpg
Views: 206
Size:  57.8 KB
    Winding gear is loose - not a big deal I thought... yet something lurks deeper as the cause of these loose parts: The screw is sheared.

    Name:  front.jpg
Views: 192
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    Crystal is a bit rough... OK it is nearly opaque and is yellowed cellulose-type crystal. Makes me wonder if this is the original crystal on it. New glass crystal should be easy enough to obtain (thanks to veritas, it was).

    Success with backing out the remains of the screw. Used a sharp graver to get a little purchase and start it rotating... reverse threads so righty-loosy.
    Name:  untreaded.jpg
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    nice clean and undamaged threads. Replacement screw was obtained by buying a partial movement from Tom at Dashto.com

    Then as I began to disassemble the movement further I came into the balance and found this...

    Name:  broken jewel.jpg
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    Its a partially shattered jewel.

    Name:  broken jewel_loose2.jpg
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    It also isn't the correct type jewel for a balance. Should be an olive jewel; looks like it is one of the jewels for the train.

    Trim to the rescue...
    Name:  side_by_side.jpg
Views: 180
Size:  74.2 KB
    bad jewel and NOS jewel via New Zealand. A check on side shake (and verifying that the jewel fits correctly) was done by placing the jewel over the pivot and seeing how it sat. Sat just slightly askew.

    Now... this was the reason I felt compelled to acquire a jeweling tool: how to install it with a degree of precision. With some guidance from someone that knows better than I, I got a Seitz set via eBay... Looks like all the others; and but only missing a few of the inexpensive bits to replace. Unfortunately these seem to all be going for well over $100 regardless if looking on eBay or the various online used/vintage tool sellers. Money well spent inho...

    Got the replacement jewel in and set the depth....
    Name:  setting.jpg
Views: 181
Size:  78.6 KB
    Had to also use the jeweling tool to peen the hole in the plate. Just a small amount as the first time I tried to fit the replacement jewel, it was too loose, i.e., not enough friction to hold the jewel securely. Likely a result from the last jewel not being correct.

    So now it is ready for the check on end shake and readjusting the depth with the micrometer setting on the jeweling tool.
    Name:  pre-clean.jpg
Views: 185
Size:  110.3 KB
    First check the free turning in various positions. As well as lifting the balance with a piece of peg wood, shows the correct amount of movement meaning the jewel is seated correctly.

    Now it is in the cleaner...

    More pictures of the reassembly and oiling later...

    Cheers!
    mmarc77, trim, Mirius and 3 others like this.
    All that I know is based on the hard work and writing of others. I can only aspire to augment this body of knowledge. If I am wrong it is because of my own failings. To quote Newton, "If I have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."

  2. #2
    Member anzac1957's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    Quote Originally Posted by JackW View Post
    About a month ago I purchased what is in my opinion (IMHO?) is a nice looking and not too common styled sterling cushion cased Cyma. Although the auction was not listing the size of the movement, I had thought it might be the slightly larger 15 jewel in the Cyma/Tavannes stable. Nope it is the cal. 030 at 10.5 ligne. Sellers images showed a few problems from the get go, but nothing I thought that would be too much of a challenge, yet something that would also help push my skills in the repair arena.

    Movement as it was advertised...

    Name:  mvt_n_case.jpg
Views: 206
Size:  57.8 KB
    Winding gear is loose - not a big deal I thought... yet something lurks deeper as the cause of these loose parts: The screw is sheared.

    Name:  front.jpg
Views: 192
Size:  51.0 KB
    Crystal is a bit rough... OK it is nearly opaque and is yellowed cellulose-type crystal. Makes me wonder if this is the original crystal on it. New glass crystal should be easy enough to obtain (thanks to veritas, it was).

    Success with backing out the remains of the screw. Used a sharp graver to get a little purchase and start it rotating... reverse threads so righty-loosy.
    Name:  untreaded.jpg
Views: 184
Size:  92.6 KB
    nice clean and undamaged threads. Replacement screw was obtained by buying a partial movement from Tom at Dashto.com

    Then as I began to disassemble the movement further I came into the balance and found this...

    Name:  broken jewel.jpg
Views: 182
Size:  144.6 KB
    Its a partially shattered jewel.

    Name:  broken jewel_loose2.jpg
Views: 179
Size:  68.2 KB
    It also isn't the correct type jewel for a balance. Should be an olive jewel; looks like it is one of the jewels for the train.

    Trim to the rescue...
    Name:  side_by_side.jpg
Views: 180
Size:  74.2 KB
    bad jewel and NOS jewel via New Zealand. A check on side shake (and verifying that the jewel fits correctly) was done by placing the jewel over the pivot and seeing how it sat. Sat just slightly askew.

    Now... this was the reason I felt compelled to acquire a jeweling tool: how to install it with a degree of precision. With some guidance from someone that knows better than I, I got a Seitz set via eBay... Looks like all the others; and but only missing a few of the inexpensive bits to replace. Unfortunately these seem to all be going for well over $100 regardless if looking on eBay or the various online used/vintage tool sellers. Money well spent inho...

    Got the replacement jewel in and set the depth....
    Name:  setting.jpg
Views: 181
Size:  78.6 KB
    Had to also use the jeweling tool to peen the hole in the plate. Just a small amount as the first time I tried to fit the replacement jewel, it was too loose, i.e., not enough friction to hold the jewel securely. Likely a result from the last jewel not being correct.

    So now it is ready for the check on end shake and readjusting the depth with the micrometer setting on the jeweling tool.
    Name:  pre-clean.jpg
Views: 185
Size:  110.3 KB
    First check the free turning in various positions. As well as lifting the balance with a piece of peg wood, shows the correct amount of movement meaning the jewel is seated correctly.

    Now it is in the cleaner...

    More pictures of the reassembly and oiling later...

    Cheers!
    I just acquired one of those movements.. looks like mainspring problem.. now I need a case for it..


    Tony Lewis
    New Zealand

  3. #3
    Member trim's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    Very nice work and I'm glad to see you're having fun with your new seitz tool

    Look forward to seeing it up and running.

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  5. #4
    Member JackW's Avatar
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    The conclusion - Cyma on the bench

    All parts (other than balance screws) went through the cleaner. I've got one of those Marshall agitator types. Does pretty well. So started to get things put together - double checked the end shake of the balance and then started in on the assembly of the train....
    Name:  train_fit.jpg
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    There was some need to adjust the end shake on the escape wheel. When the train bridge was screwed into place fully the train would not freely turn. So, using the jeweling set I added 1/100's of a mm to the depth and the train was free.
    Name:  train_adjust.jpg
Views: 94
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    Next up was getting the barrel reassembled with a new spring (Best Fit # MS-611K). Twin City Supply, a US based supply house had a spring in white metal; the blued one from the watch although not broken, was set.
    Name:  spring.jpg
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    Barrel and bridge in place...
    Name:  barrel_bridge.jpg
Views: 90
Size:  124.3 KB
    Turned out I needed to adjust the depth of the center wheel jewel on the bridge too. Really getting my money's worth out of that jeweling tool.
    Name:  ready2fit.jpg
Views: 91
Size:  131.7 KB
    Balance in place, winding mechanism fully assembled and everything lubed. New stem too (also from Twin City Supply) and away it ran... and then a check on timing and adjustment:
    Name:  trace.jpg
Views: 92
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    Amplitude is high... likely the white metal spring... but it isn't too high as there is no indication of lash-back in the trace. Some minor noise but it looks good. I could drop the amplitude a bit by lubricating the pivots on the anchor. So leaving it as it is, it goes into the case.
    Name:  cased.jpg
Views: 91
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    Getting this cased was actually difficult because 1) the clutch pinion kept slipping out from under the clutch level when ever I removed the stem and then I could get the stem back in and 2) I pulled a noob mistake and trimmed the stem a hair short. Had to use a different crown (gold colored) that fit the stem as cut. After several tries of getting the movement in place I got the stem to sit and properly tighten the detent screw. So here it is finished...

    Name:  done.jpg
Views: 92
Size:  102.3 KBName:  cased2.jpg
Views: 90
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    The four-part hinged case is what I like about this watch. Dial is untouched as I found it, figure the patina is pretty even.

    Thanks for reading this far.
    Last edited by JackW; November 22nd, 2015 at 22:18.
    Mirius, trim, James A and 2 others like this.
    All that I know is based on the hard work and writing of others. I can only aspire to augment this body of knowledge. If I am wrong it is because of my own failings. To quote Newton, "If I have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."

  6. #5
    Member JackW's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    Quote Originally Posted by trim View Post
    Look forward to seeing it up and running.
    Just let me know when you want to come for dinner. I'll gladly show the watch to you.
    All that I know is based on the hard work and writing of others. I can only aspire to augment this body of knowledge. If I am wrong it is because of my own failings. To quote Newton, "If I have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."

  7. #6
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    Re: The conclusion - Cyma on the bench

    Wow that really came out nice!The dial looks great and I like that case too.
    JackW likes this.

  8. #7
    Member trim's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    Quote Originally Posted by JackW View Post
    Just let me know when you want to come for dinner. I'll gladly show the watch to you.
    Hmmm, I think I've visited you 4 or 5 times when you were in Chicago. Might be time for you to come over to NZ for a visit

    Lovely watch, nice work, congrats!

    Also, about the crown - you need one of these



    Its for making small lead slugs, for when you've cut the stem too short!



    Pretty rare I guess, I have only ever seen this one. Once cut, it has a long pin for pressing it into the crown.

    Kris.
    Last edited by trim; November 23rd, 2015 at 03:09.
    James A and anzac1957 like this.

  9. #8
    Member JackW's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    That is an interesting tool. I was thinking I could drop a small chip of either sterling or copper cut from wire as a plug in the crown. But I wanted to use that as a last resort. The crown I used is a pretty good fit, both to the case (and stem tube) and the age but its off color (gold-ish). It doesn't bother me that much.

    ....and as to coming to NZ. That is on the list in the coming years. I may need to sell the kid first however special after the house purchase.
    All that I know is based on the hard work and writing of others. I can only aspire to augment this body of knowledge. If I am wrong it is because of my own failings. To quote Newton, "If I have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."

  10. #9
    Member trim's Avatar
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    Re: Cyma on the bench

    Excuses! Congrats on the house and impending new watch room!

    Anyway, I hardly think that the little tool I posted is 'good practice' but it is no doubt very convenient. I don't see why a appropriately sized piece of other soft metal wouldn't be fine.

    I have a number of early silver cases with GF crowns. I suspect it was a 'thing' at some point. Yours does suit well enough.

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