Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

Thread: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

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  1. #1
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    Question Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Hi, I have three mechanical watches I have bought for my girlfriend over time. They were all sold as Sirrom, but each has a movement from a different manufacturer and each a case from a different manufacturer.

    I've Googled all the clues I've been able to gather, but with little success. I was hoping someone here could provide me some information or point me to a reference source either at the library or on the world wide webs. Thanks, and here they go:

    #1 - no markings on dial, movement signed Sirrom Swiss and marked "16 Sixteen Jewels", "2 adjustments". The case is marked S&S WCCo. "14K gold filled" and "25 Years". There is also an engraving which is unreadable - 194?, I think.








    #2 - dial is marked Sirrom, movement is signed Swiss Wega Watch Co. and marked "15 Jewels", "3 three adjustments". The case is marked Liberty WCCo. "bestwhite edition" and "rolled plate" with an engraved date of 1947.








    #3 - dial is marked Sirrom, movement is signed Betina Watch Co. Swiss, "6 Jewels", "3 adjustments". The case is marked Gerber Swiss.










    If any one has any clues and some additional pictures would be helpful, please let me know. Thanks

  2. #2
    Member Eeeb's Avatar
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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Others may recognize just from the bridge layouts but it can help a great deal if you find maker marks on the movement. Usually they are located under the balance wheel.

    Both movements look to have been very good ones when they were made based on the number of adjustments and jewels. In the trades these were in the class of "highly jeweled movements".
    "Forever is composed of nows." - Emily Dickinson

    "The watch has to be surrounded by a history.
    You need more than just a great design. You need to create an atmosphere around the product.
    Who is the company behind it? Why are they using this material?
    People need to be able to identify the watch with themselves. It's based on emotion." - Ralph Furter

    ...that's just my opinion and I've been wrong before and will be again and might be now!

  3. #3
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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Not familiar the name, but it occurs to me that Sirrom is Morris spelled backwards...probably a house brand.
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

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  5. #4
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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Quote Originally Posted by Eeeb View Post
    Others may recognize just from the bridge layouts but it can help a great deal if you find maker marks on the movement. Usually they are located under the balance wheel.

    Both movements look to have been very good ones when they were made based on the number of adjustments and jewels. In the trades these were in the class of "highly jeweled movements".
    Thanks for the information.

    I examined the movements and intact I'm not able to see any markings under or near the balance wheel - and I certainly have no qualifications to open them up. I'm sure this is ignorant, but why would a maker's mark be different than a mfr. mark? I assume you mean that it would indicate an individual watch maker, but could you then elicit useful information from there that you could not with only a mfr.'s name?

    Also, any standard reference books that catalog these sorts of things?


    Quote Originally Posted by AbslomRob View Post
    Not familiar the name, but it occurs to me that Sirrom is Morris spelled backwards...probably a house brand.
    Interesting observation - is Morris of some significance in the watch world? What can I discern of these movements if they are in fact house brands?


    I'd love to track some information down here, as historical provenance is very interesting to me. My next stop I suppose would be to a research library to look for reference materials.

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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    I get the sense that no one can identify the movements, but I'm bumping this thread in hopes that someone can answer some of the other questions raised, i.e., what other clues can I look for to help identify these watches, are there any standard library reference materials for research?

    Or and I on a wild goose chase, is the information I am looking for lost to history?

  7. #6
    Member Eeeb's Avatar
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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanne View Post
    I get the sense that no one can identify the movements, but I'm bumping this thread in hopes that someone can answer some of the other questions raised, i.e., what other clues can I look for to help identify these watches, are there any standard library reference materials for research?

    Or and I on a wild goose chase, is the information I am looking for lost to history?
    There are a number of catalogs that have pics and drawings aimed at collectors. And the watchmaker trade has BestFit. Spend some time book searching on Alibris or Amazon and look at what is produced.

    In addition watch collector societies with museums usually have a library for use by their members. Their collections exceed any available elsewhere.

    Every watch has a story, at least in Vintage!
    "Forever is composed of nows." - Emily Dickinson

    "The watch has to be surrounded by a history.
    You need more than just a great design. You need to create an atmosphere around the product.
    Who is the company behind it? Why are they using this material?
    People need to be able to identify the watch with themselves. It's based on emotion." - Ralph Furter

    ...that's just my opinion and I've been wrong before and will be again and might be now!

  8. #7
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    Re: Info on 2nd Qtr 20th C Swiss Movements/cases

    Hi Johanne,

    which of these three movements do you believe are the same calibres?



    Wrong! The first two are the same, the third is a small ladies movement.

    Or which of these three movements do you believe are the same calibres?



    Also wrong! The first two are the same, the third is bigger and some 20
    years younger.

    Especially very old calibres were made in various bridge layouts, to let
    them appear as in-house movements of the watch manufacturer. Only
    with the diameter and the heigth there is a chance to identify them.
    Even better is a dial view (without dial), because the base plate is almost
    not modified for the various designs. And if you are lucky, the designation
    is written under the dial.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft

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