Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

Thread: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

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  1. #1
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    Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    I am new to vintage watches, I was hoping someone can let me know whether these are authentic or not.

    Baume Mercier Men Wrist Chronograph Great Vintage Timepiece for Collectors | eBay

    Vintage Baume Mercier Chronograph Golden Sunburst Dial | eBay

    Vintage Girard Perregaux Fancy Two Toned Golden Textured Design Dial | eBay

    If you have any suggestions where else I can find these other then ebay please let me know.

  2. #2
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Hi there,

    both brands belong to the most freqently faked, and all three are fakes. If you are new to old watches, simply stay away from these brands. When you become more experienced you'll stay away voluntarily, because you became tired to pick the few originals out of the heap of junk.

    Moreover most vintage watches of these brands have just generic movements from mass production, and you get much more watch for the buck with most other brands. And precisely this is the reason why they can be faked so easily.

    And last not least you always should look what a seller offers else. The seller "absolute-antiques" should rename himself to "absolute-fakes". I found just two items in his collection which may be original (by accident?). He is obvouously the US general importer for South American junk.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft
    Last edited by Roland Ranfft; November 27th, 2013 at 20:41.

  3. #3
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    What Roland said. Also, I recommend looking for a particular watch rather than just "a vintage watch." Find a certain vintage watch that you really like and fits your budget, and then learn everything you can about it. Search for them on eBay, and practice telling the fakes from the real ones, posting links here is a good way to check. If you focus on a particular watch it will make learning to spot a good one much easier. It's best to find something that isn't too popular or valuable, because those watches aren't likely to be faked or frankened.

    Don't buy on impulse, and don't hunt for bargains, or you will tempt regret.

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  5. #4
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Thanks guys!!!! I was looking at these particular models, I really like the vintage Baume Chronograph and the GP. Any way you can help me with this? Or maybe is there another similar brand less faked? How were you able to see there fake?

  6. #5
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Hi there,

    dials with weakly contrasting colors may look attractive to some, but almost all are fancy designs to imitate orginals which appear to have differing colors due to different surface treatment - grinding in different directions, frosted finish in contrast to glossy etc. On these dials the colors vary with the aspect angle. As it is expensive to restore such feature, botchers prefer to print different colors.

    Here an example:



    This dial is grinded vertically, but between edge and center a ring is circularly grinded. The ring looks much darker than the rest on top, but has nearly the same brightness at the bottom. And the numerals appear nearly black, although they are just glossy gilt, and may look bright yellow under other conditions. All depends on ambient light and aspect angle though. Not all old watches have this design but many, and often the more expensive models. The fancy dials of the fakers just aim to imitate expensve dials of expensive watches, and I'd get eczema when wearing such stuff.

    The Landeron movement in both of the linked Baume & Mercier chronographs was available for about one Dollar after WWII. This was more back then than today, but still dirt cheap for a movement of decent quality. But if ever B&M applied it, they surely made no Rolls Royce from a Fiat Punto. So better take any no-name sample with the same movement.

    Generally nobody can write down some decades of experience here. So newbies should restrict in the first step to watches which are not worth the effort to be faked. And even if you later can distinguish between a B&M with Landeron and an equivalent with the same movement, you'll not be so crazy to pay a premium just for the signature.

    And refering the GP? The parts came from watches with the so called Wehrmacht standard (army standard). Many companies offered them as rugged watches with decent quality. But after renaming all parts to deceive newbies it is simply trash.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft
    Last edited by Roland Ranfft; November 28th, 2013 at 07:27.

  7. #6
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Sorry to bump this thread up but i am trying to find out more information about the seller when i come across a GP hand wind.

    Vintage Girard Perregaux Classic Dial Just Serviced | eBay

    Anyway, I notice the seller is around me (he is only 15 minutes away) so i want to see it in person and crawling the web for his info. Good to know i have to watch out for this guy.

    If you can tell me what he is selling is real or fake it would be a bonus :)

    And if you have dealt with him before, do you have a phone number or address where he can be reached? thanks.

  8. #7
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Well, the watch is now sold - either to yourself or to someone else. I would have given it a miss. Why?

    1. Dial refinished. This is at least openly admitted, I would prefer it not to be, at least not unless I knew what it looked like before so I can make sure it is an exact copy of the original

    2. Case refinished - despite being not stainless steel but chromed brass. Another point towards non-originality

    3. Movement (Wehrmachtskaliber AS 1130 derivative) unmarked by GP on bridges (as they usually are in GP watches in my experience), just on mainspring wheel, and here somewhat feebly. Movement possibly original, but one will never know

    So, too many uncertain factors here. Still, if you managed to end up with it, I hope that you are pleased. You may well have different priorities than me.

    Hartmut Richter

  9. #8
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    I didnt buy it. The listing ended with no bids, i believe.

    I am curious about this seller mostly because he is local and i can inspect the merchandise before buying.

  10. #9
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Ok, just saw this thread, for us newbies to vintage collecting it's great to get feedback from pros - some of you have been following my jump into 1920/30s art deco with some mixed luck so far, but not due I believe to watches being faked. But given the heads-up on GP watches, I thought I would put one up I am looking at purchasing. This is a gyromatic early 70s watch - I don't have a movement pic yet but I believe this is a reputable dealer. I am also waiting to find out the exact movement and whether this is the hi beat 36k hz movement like my new Zenith EP. Any quick feedback from just the main pic ? Cheers, SDA
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    Last edited by Sdasurrey; March 6th, 2014 at 08:35.
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  11. #10
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    Re: Interested in buying vintage watch. Need oppinions

    Looks OK from this angle. It all depends on a movement picture.....

    What should you expect inside? I don't know for certain, but since the only high beat GP movement with day-date listed by Ranfft is the Cal. 440, based on the Adolf Schild Cal. 1920:

    bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: Girard-Perregaux 440 (AS 1920)

    ...this is what I would expect.

    Hartmut Richter

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