Longines Pocket Watch Help

Thread: Longines Pocket Watch Help

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  1. #1
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    Longines Pocket Watch Help

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    I recently inherited a 14K Longines pocket watch from my Grandfather. He was a pilot in the US Navy, and served in WWI and the Korean War. I have tried to do a little research on the watch, but I am hopeful to gain more info ration. Here are some of the characteristics of the watch:

    The back case is engraved with two women tending to a horse, with some children surrounding them. On the bottom there is an engraving that says: A. Wittnaher
    Stamped on the inside of the case is #1,871,370 which I believe to date the watch between 1905 - 1907.
    On the top of the gears the same number appears.
    It is stamped 14k along with a rabbit stamp which I believe confirms it is made of 14 karat gold and from Switzerland.
    On the back cover next to the gears it is stamped: AW in a circle.
    Deep inside the gears there is a stamp which reads: +NO22107
    Another stamp on the gears either reads: EAST or FAST
    The final "factory" engraving that I can find is on the gears and says:
    3 ADJ. 17 Jewels
    Longines W. Co. Swiss
    2988214

    As this watch has family heritage attached to it I am very interested in finding out any further information that someone might be able to offer. I have no idea of the monetary value of the watch, but that is really secondary to the family value that it holds.

    Two main questions that I have are:
    -I am unable to find the winged stamp that I have seen on many Longines watches. Did they produce watches without there trademark stamp?
    -The stamp on the inside of the gears,
    +NO22107 dates the watch (according to some websites) around 1870, while the other serial number on the gears, 1,871,370 dates the watch around 1905.

    This watch has really peeked my interest in pocket watches, and any additional information that someone might have would be GREATLY appreciated.
    Thanks in advance,
    Zach

    Thank you for the help! I have contacted Longines and hope to hear from them. I have also attached a new photo of the gears.
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    Thanks again for all the feedback. I was able to take a couple additional photos with some better detail......
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    This is the number behind the gears that might be the patient number?????

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    A better picture of the case.

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    A better picture of the gears.

    Thanks again, I am finding this investigation to be fascinating!
    Last edited by zblick7; June 25th, 2013 at 21:17.

  2. #2
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Hi and welcome
    You should post movement pictures.
    The case serial number is irrelevant you need the movement serial number to date . You say 2988214
    That dates your watch to first half of 1913.
    Wittnauer were for many years Longines agents in USA.
    Not all movements have the winged logo

    Now the great thing about Longines is they have all the written records going back to prior 1900.
    If you write them with details (serial number) they will tell you all the provenance of your watch

    Sorry to say I thhink the dial is reworked the 'LONGINES' name just does not look good enough

    The balance wheel will say FAST (not EAST)/SLOW its an adjuster
    Last edited by HOROLOGIST007; June 24th, 2013 at 10:09.
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

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  3. #3
    Member Eeeb's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    A pic of the movement itself would be most helpful. It may be Longines sold the movement and the case itself was supplied by a jeweler. There is a thread in the Links and Articles subforum which tells how to open these cases.

    Longines itself will supply a synopsis of their records telling to whom they actually sold the watch and when.

    Nice heirloom! Therein lies the real value of the piece.
    "Forever is composed of nows." - Emily Dickinson

    "The watch has to be surrounded by a history.
    You need more than just a great design. You need to create an atmosphere around the product.
    Who is the company behind it? Why are they using this material?
    People need to be able to identify the watch with themselves. It's based on emotion." - Ralph Furter

    ...that's just my opinion and I've been wrong before and will be again and might be now!

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  5. #4
    Member jedanzoom's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    I belive its Longines cal.17.90 ABC.Nice watch!
    “Thoughts are the shadows of our feelings - always darker, emptier and simpler.”

    Friedrich Nietzsche

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  6. #5
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    The "dateable" serial number is the 2985214; the case serial number isnt' usually useful, as there are very few records from case manufacturuers. Wittnaeur was Longine's exclusive agent in North America for the early part of the 20th century, so most Longines sold here would have come from Wittnaeur. The style of the movement and the movement markings are all consistent with a 1913 date. I'm curious about the +NO22107; is it swiss cross? If so, that indicates a patent number, but those don't usually have letters in them.
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

  7. #6
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Quote Originally Posted by AbslomRob View Post
    I'm curious about the +NO22107; is it swiss cross? If so, that indicates a patent number, but those don't usually have letters in them.
    I think you will find that is the country code, in this case NORWAY
    It indicates the country or organization where patent was filed or granted

    Switzerland is CH
    Great Britain is GB

    Regards
    Last edited by HOROLOGIST007; June 25th, 2013 at 19:41.
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

    "Failure is not an option" - Gene Kranz
    "Owning a vintage watch is great, understanding where it sits in Horology is magnificent"
    and
    "By Teaching Others, We Teach Ourselves"
    Adam

  8. #7
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Thanks so much for the help. Yes, I would say it is a cross, followed by a large capital "N" and a small case "o" with two lines under it, then followed by the numbers 22107

  9. #8
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Either capital
    NO or strange. To morrow I will do some searches.

  10. #9
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Quote Originally Posted by HOROLOGIST007 View Post
    I think you will find that is the country code, in this case NORWAY
    It indicates the country or organization where patent was filed or granted
    Unfortunately, that wouldn't make sense, since AFAIK the swiss cross specifically indicates a swiss patent. The No is probably short for "Numero". Notably, there is a swiss patent no. 22107 that describes a form of stopworks: Espacenet - Original document
    It was registered in 1900 to Francillon and Co. That's actually part of the name of Longines: Compagnie des Montres Longines Francillon SA.
    Last edited by AbslomRob; June 25th, 2013 at 21:21.
    My growing collection of "affordable" vintages: http://www.abslomrob.com

  11. #10
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Longines Pocket Watch Help

    Quote Originally Posted by AbslomRob View Post
    Unfortunately, that wouldn't make sense, since AFAIK the swiss cross specifically indicates a swiss patent. The No is probably short for "Numero". Notably, there is a swiss patent no. 22107 that describes a form of stopworks: Espacenet - Original document
    It was registered in 1900 to Francillon and Co. That's actually part of the name of Longines: Compagnie des Montres Longines Francillon SA.
    Yes that makes sense now
    But to your prior comment.
    Letters can/DO proceed patents

    Regards
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

    "Failure is not an option" - Gene Kranz
    "Owning a vintage watch is great, understanding where it sits in Horology is magnificent"
    and
    "By Teaching Others, We Teach Ourselves"
    Adam

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