Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight
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Thread: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

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  1. #1
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    Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    My quest to find an inexpensive watch to take on backpacking trips has turned into a new passion. I purchased a Hamilton Mechanical Field watch eta 2804 HW to start. After a couple Seikos, & a few more Hamiltons, I graduated to my real love, the Germans.

    Vintage watch collecting is way out of my league, however, never in my right mind would I have thought I'd get so much enjoyment learning about watches and the different movements that drive them.

    As for the Lord Elgin, it may have sentimental value to me.

    I have to look at some old photos from the 50's to verify whether this Knight was worn by my father and not something he picked up at a yard sale during his retirement years. Although I'm pretty sure I remember seeing it on his wrist in some old black and white photos.

    After many years of seeing and ignoring the watch, I decided to pull it out of his old secretary to evaluate condition and find out the make of this old golden watch.

    The crystal and case is in good shape. No dings or deep scratches. The problem seems to be in the crown. It only turns counter-clockwise. Clockwise is frozen.

    If it does turn out to be my fathers, thus having sentimental value, I'm considering searching for a watchmaker to see if it can be brought back to life.

    Any ideas why the watch will not wind? I know the oils are going to be a major reason. Is it possible they're the only reason? Or, is there a common issue with the crown, which may have caused it to seize if miss handled.

    Just wanted to run it past some knowledgeable folks who wouldn't mind pointing me in the right direction. Any thoughts, or ideas, you may want to contribute would be appreciated. If not, just posting some information about a time piece my father was fond of is a win for me.

    Thanks.

    RR

  2. #2
    Member Dan S's Avatar
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Most likely it is already fully wound, so you can't wind it further.
    simpletreasures and pithy like this.
    -- Dan (formerly known as @badbackdan)
    ------- @oldwatchdan on Instagram -------

  3. #3
    Member pithy's Avatar
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Is this the 680 grade movement?

    If so, it is fairly evolved and potentially capable of quite good service.
    Courtesy of ULF.

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  5. #4
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Quote Originally Posted by pithy View Post
    Is this the 680 grade movement?

    If so, it is fairly evolved and potentially capable of quite good service.
    Black Knights came with the 556, 680, 713, and 718 movements. Knights with the latter two are a LOT less common, AND they're in a significantly different case.

    Interestingly, I generally have better results with 556's than 680s. My 556's run like...well, fine watches, whereas my 680s tend to be more finicky. Harder to get good amplitude, for example, which I find with the whole 680 series.
    Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent - Pogo

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  6. #5
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneJockey View Post
    Black Knights came with the 556, 680, 713, and 718 movements. Knights with the latter two are a LOT less common, AND they're in a significantly different case.

    Interestingly, I generally have better results with 556's than 680s. My 556's run like...well, fine watches, whereas my 680s tend to be more finicky. Harder to get good amplitude, for example, which I find with the whole 680 series.
    Which mainspring are you using in 680?
    Courtesy of ULF.

  7. #6
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Quote Originally Posted by pithy View Post
    Which mainspring are you using in 680?
    I'm cheap, so as long as there's significant reverse curl on the barrel hook end, I reuse what comes in it. But I recently acquired a bunch of NOS Durapower mainsprings. I'll check what they are and get back to you.

    I don't tend to have the same problems with the 554 series movements, or any of the 15/0s. Just the 680 series.
    pithy likes this.
    Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent - Pogo

    My Elgin Blog...

  8. #7
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Oops! Turns out the cache of NOS mainsprings are all 15/0. I have a smaller number of 8/0 mainsprings in the following strengths:

    .0037
    .0039
    .0041 (2 of these)
    .0043

    What should I be using with the 680? According to the 1958 Elgin Mainspring Reference List, that covers the range of Durapower mainsprings for the whole 8/0 range. Normally, i'd expect the lower values to be appropriate for the higher jewel counts, right?
    Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent - Pogo

    My Elgin Blog...

  9. #8
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneJockey View Post
    Oops! Turns out the cache of NOS mainsprings are all 15/0. I have a smaller number of 8/0 mainsprings in the following strengths:

    .0037
    .0039
    .0041 (2 of these)
    .0043

    What should I be using with the 680? According to the 1958 Elgin Mainspring Reference List, that covers the range of Durapower mainsprings for the whole 8/0 range. Normally, i'd expect the lower values to be appropriate for the higher jewel counts, right?
    Whatever yields the desired amplitude for an otherwise corrected movement.

    I would have anticipated .095 mm or .099 mm at most but the two grades are from different branches of the tree with limited component interchangeability and have the dynamics attributable to each.
    Courtesy of ULF.

  10. #9
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    Re: Lord Elgin 14k GF Black Golden Knight

    Quote Originally Posted by pithy View Post
    Whatever yields the desired amplitude for an otherwise corrected movement.

    I would have anticipated .095 mm or .099 mm at most but the two grades are from different branches of the tree with limited component interchangeability and have the dynamics attributable to each.
    In mm, they run from 0.094 to 0.109.
    Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent - Pogo

    My Elgin Blog...

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