Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement
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Thread: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

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  1. #1
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    Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    I had read that in the USA JLC Memovox models were branded LeCoultre - minus the Jaeger. If I've got a Jaeger LeCoultre signed movement but LeCoultre only signed dial - am I dealing with a Frankenwatch here?
    Cheers,
    Justin

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    I must say that I am having a hard time finding a single Memovox movement in Horlbeck's "Der Armbandwecker" with just "LeCoultre" on it! I am not sure they made the movements that way at all......

    Hartmut Richter

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Quote Originally Posted by Hartmut Richter View Post
    I must say that I am having a hard time finding a single Memovox movement in Horlbeck's "Der Armbandwecker" with just "LeCoultre" on it! I am not sure they made the movements that way at all......

    Hartmut Richter
    That's interesting!

    Here's a quote from the article where I found the information about LeCoultre on both the dial and movement needing to match:

    "There is also the matter of "LeCoultre" vs. "Jaeger-LeCoultre" signatures on both the dials and the movements of watches of this era. For much of the mid-twentieth century, Jaeger-LeCoultre watches sold in the US market were sold under the LeCoultre brand name. Both dials and movements bore this signature, and on any given watch the two should match. For years it was incorrectly assumed that these did not necessarily need to match up, but that is just not the case. Check that both dial and movement bear the same signature, otherwise you're likely getting a so-called Frankenwatch."

    Link to the full article:
    http://www.hodinkee.com/blog/a-week-on-the-wrist-the-jaeger-lecoultre-memovox-cal-825

    Confusing. The dial on the Memovox I've got has LeCoultre on it but the movement has Jaeger LeCoultre. According to the article I've got a watch with a few mismatched details.
    Cheers,
    Justin

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Unfortunately, M-P.H. doesn't discuss that. Furthermore, his movement pictures and watch pictures are in separate sections so you can't tell which relates to which. Nevertheless, he does have a few with "LeCoultre" dial but I can't find a single movement without the "Jaeger".

    The bottom line: some evidence against the theory, nothing conclusive. Anyone else?

    Hartmut Richter
    JustinD likes this.

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Hi Justin,

    Here is a tread showing a LeCoultre dial and movement for a Cal 825. So perhaps there is some truth to this. I can only guess that at some stage the movement was swapped by a watchmaker because the original was damaged and he was unable to get the American market movement.

    https://forums.watchuseek.com/f419/jl...on-784514.html

    Regards,

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    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Personally, I doubt it was switched out and suspect this is 100% original and genuine.
    I will check it out to-morrow at the Museum, I have all my files there.
    Does your watch have the LXJ import mark for Jaeger/LeCoultre?
    Regards
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    The one thing I'll point out is that to be imported into the U.S., the movement had to show either the name of the manufacturer or the name of the importer. What was the actual name of the Swiss company, and what was the name of the registered US company that imported them?
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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Quote Originally Posted by AbslomRob View Post
    The one thing I'll point out is that to be imported into the U.S., the movement had to show either the name of the manufacturer or the name of the importer. What was the actual name of the Swiss company, and what was the name of the registered US company that imported them?
    I suspect both were registered.
    The LXJ letters are attributed to both Jaeger-LeCoultre and LeCoultre
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Quote Originally Posted by HOROLOGIST007 View Post
    I suspect both were registered.
    The LXJ letters are attributed to both Jaeger-LeCoultre and LeCoultre
    You misunderstand how import codes work. The import code belongs to a US company exclusively. That has little or no bearing on the brands that can be imported with that code on them, and doesn't necessarily have any bearing on the name that is engraved on the movement. In this particular case, I suspect that "Lecoutre Co" was the name of the US company.

    As far as I can tell, the Swiss company was named "SOCIETE DE VENTE DES PRODUITS JAEGER-LECOULTRE S.A.", so a watch with "Jaeger-Lecoultre" could legally have been imported with the JLX import code.
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    Re: Memovox Cal 825 - LeCoultre on Dial but Jaeger LeCoultre on Movement

    Quote Originally Posted by HOROLOGIST007 View Post
    I suspect both were registered.
    The LXJ letters are attributed to both Jaeger-LeCoultre and LeCoultre
    Yes, but I think this mark predates the introduction of the Memovox line in the later 1940's.

    Most US market LeCoultre movements from post-WWII through the 1970's had the import mark "VXN", which I believe was assigned to the Longines Wittnauer Company of New York. They imported Vacheron & Constantin, LeCoultre, Longines and Wittnauer watch movements from Switzerland. Of these, only the V&C's were imported with adjustments and casing done in Switzerland. "LXW" denotes Longines. I'm not sure of the correct mark for Wittnauer (Edit - I found it -- "AXA"):

    Ranfft Watches, US Import Codes

    Here is an example:



    Evidence of the relationships of the import company may be found in contemporary advertising:



    Note that this ad has a V&C pocketwatch as well as many LeCoultre wristwatches.

    I think that there were some very early Memovoxes that were imported with JLC-branded movements, but most of the time the parts would have been interchageable and a repairman could have very easily replaced parts of one brand with those of another.

    Without pictures, it's impossible to say for sure.
    gatorcpa
    Last edited by gatorcpa; November 15th, 2014 at 23:17.

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