Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information
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Thread: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

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  1. #1
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    Question Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    I have an original Movado Museum 14k gold solid men's watch that upon inspection has some different information that I could use help deciphering. The case number is 246 224 085 then a number below it as 02585. The MVT is Calibre 246 17J, no SN number. The bezel is 32.50 mm and the thickness is 6.88 mm including the crystal. The inside back case is marked U.S.A. MOVADO but it was bought for a fact I know as my sister bought a men's and women's for my parents between 1971 and 1976 in Europe when she went overseas and gave them to them on her return. I was only 11-15 years old so I can't remember what year and I am the only surviving member of my family so I have no receipts or boxes but the pictures show you what the master watch repairman showed me. It was my Father's watch I inherited almost 30 years ago and I have 2 severely Autistic children, ADHD and heavily medicated and can not pass the watch to them as they would lose it or destroy it in nothing flat. I have kept it in a temperature controlled safe and worn it less than 15 times in 30 years it runs beautifully. I may be ready to part with it to a collector if it turns out to be unusual due to what you all see and tell me as Movado was completely unhelpful except for a steep fee for very little information other than a generic appraisal and I am trying to figure out how a 14k solid gold version of this watch bought in Europe could be marked U.S.A. and "Swiss Factories" stamped inside at the same time? I would like to figure out the year of manufacture and if this piece is possibly more unusual or authentic than others made around that time frame. It is also marked "MOVADO 14k Gold" on the outside as seen in the pics and says "MOVADO Swiss" on the outside front lower edge. Any help with information is appreciated.



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  2. #2
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    Welcome to Watchuseek. The movement in your watch is actually not by Movado but rather by Universal Geneve and made available to Movado:

    bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: Movado 246 (Universal 42)

    Movado joined up with Mondia and Zenith in 1969 to form the MZM group, after which they mainly used their own movements as well as Zenith movements. Therefore, the watch may well be from before 1969 although there is no guarantee of that. If so, not very long before that, I'd say - the style definitely points to the 1960s.

    Hartmut Richter
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  3. #3
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    Thank you, I suspected older than 1971 as my sister went there then but is a conundrum how USA and Swiss end up inside a watch that was bought in Europe, thank you for my first lead...pre 1969! I hope other chime on on that and confirm it

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  5. #4
    Vint. Forum Co-Moderator Mirius's Avatar
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    Just an observation but experience shows us that memories of family watches can be a fickle thing especially when assumptions are made creating links that don't exist. Your conundrum may simply prove to be that this isn't the watch bought by your sister in Europe but one obtained by your father previously.


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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    …to add to Mirius' comments, take a quick look at this profile on Wikipedia. The case is marked as USA, the movement is a Swiss one, no real mystery there, as Movado didn't actually make this movement themselves, as HR commented earlier, but bought it and branded it with their logo. The watch could have been bought either in the US or Europe, I think. It's an early Museum, solid gold and easy to find similar on eBay to get a sense of its market value.

    If you're really concerned, you could write to Movado and ask them if they have any database to establish when the watch was made. As to dates, as you'll see from the article, HR's comments don't suggest when this model was made, only when a company was formed - the design originates much earlier.


    But I really don't see your concern about the US marked case / Swiss movement - it's very common, the watch industry is international and due to various custom regulations (especially on rare metal cases like this), you find companies importing movements from Switzerland and fitting them to cases made locally to avoid punitive taxes. Omega, for example, did it all the time with various case makers in the US, UK, France. And so many, many, other USA domestic companies such as Benrus, Hamilton, Wittnauer… and it's been a very long time since the US has had much in the way of volume manufacturers making watch movements in the USA, so Swiss would be the logical source for mechanical movements at that time.
    Last edited by Habitant; February 17th, 2016 at 15:42.

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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    Mirius, I thank you for your input but I was sitting in the living room and watched my sister had her hand my parents their presents (the his and her matching watches) and she had come back from Europe where she got them of that I am 100% sure. So my father I know did not buy his earlier. However Habitant brought up something else that was very helpful in the mixing and matching to avoid tariffs and taxes that was very helpful and explains what might have happened. I believe the watches were purchased at a "PX" on a US Naval base as my sister was visiting her husband while he was stationed overseas during that time. Hence the watch may have been bought overseas but was actually supplied via US channels and simply shipped back to Europe for sale at a US PX. Movado told me on the phone that they kept no records as to manufacture date since I noted that the watch has no SN. As you can see in the pics all the logos and numbers are properly formatted, etc but a year of manufacture is my last piece of this puzzle and given the MVT I have in my watch is that a better movement or preferred movement as well as does it put it in the 60's or the 70's and is there higher worth as Hartmut Richter pointed out is it "pre or post MZM group"?
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    I feel certain that the 1960-70s version (yours) is more valuable than the newer quartz version, for example, but perhaps not as valuable as earlier models. The vast majority of those I've seen are pretty similar to yours or else newer quartz versions, I haven't seen anything older, so…

    It's a bit tricky, because the way that Movado have produced the watch (too many versions, too much supply) has pushed a fine design into the 'jewellery watch' category and that negatively impacts on what the value might be to a watch collector. Most of the folks here, for example, will be looking for rarer, more exotic items. So the Museum is a very nice watch, but not as valuable as you might expect, coming out of a great design heritage and produced by a company that was once much more significant to collectors. At the moment, it's kind of a commodity watch, so many out there that the price they get is subject to brutal market forces. Ouch. Silly Movado.

    Movado are trying to row back and re-establish their credentials with collectors, but they have a way to travel to regain their prestige.

    I don't think that the 'pre or post MZM group' would have any bearing on the value of this watch; it was, I believe (HR would know more…), a change of corporate structure more than anything else.

    I think the PX thing is the answer to the US marks.




    Quote Originally Posted by Dtwins View Post
    Mirius, I thank you for your input but I was sitting in the living room and watched my sister had her hand my parents their presents (the his and her matching watches) and she had come back from Europe where she got them of that I am 100% sure. So my father I know did not buy his earlier. However Habitant brought up something else that was very helpful in the mixing and matching to avoid tariffs and taxes that was very helpful and explains what might have happened. I believe the watches were purchased at a "PX" on a US Naval base as my sister was visiting her husband while he was stationed overseas during that time. Hence the watch may have been bought overseas but was actually supplied via US channels and simply shipped back to Europe for sale at a US PX. Movado told me on the phone that they kept no records as to manufacture date since I noted that the watch has no SN. As you can see in the pics all the logos and numbers are properly formatted, etc but a year of manufacture is my last piece of this puzzle and given the MVT I have in my watch is that a better movement or preferred movement as well as does it put it in the 60's or the 70's and is there higher worth as Hartmut Richter pointed out is it "pre or post MZM group"?
    Last edited by Habitant; February 18th, 2016 at 00:25.

  9. #8
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    It's a nice watch. I've always liked the design. I'm wearing my museum dial now. It's a modern steel Serio. It was my first watch I bought at the very beginning of my obsession. I would like one of the vintage one like yours one day.
    "A watch is ruined, not by time, but by bad handling. To run well it should be wound regularly, cleaned yearly, and, if injured, taken to a competent, practical man. A ​Waltham watch properly cared for will last a lifetime." -American Waltham Watch Co. Catalog (c) 1900
    “When your watch gets out of order you have a choice of two things to do: throw it in the fire or take it to the watch-tinker. The former is the quickest.” -Mark Twain

  10. #9
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    Re: Movado Museum original 14k solid I need help with identifying information

    I suppose someone has to ask: do I see wear on the bottom of the case, under the crown, that--on a watch not marked 14K Gold--I would certainly ascribe to worn-through gold plate, or, at best, gold fill?? I assume that it's a 'trick of the light', yes...??

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