Onsa / ETA movement – questions
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Thread: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

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  1. #1
    Member Border-Reiver's Avatar
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    Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    I want to sort this Onsa automatic watch into my collection. It has an ETA movement which puzzles me a bit.

    First of all, it has this cursed ETA-disease of putting the caliber markings directly (I mean absolutely perpendicular) under the balance wheel, whatever the reason is for this idiotic positioning (see an authorized dealer to find out?). Yes, there are other manufacturers who have these markings in strange places, but ETA has made an art of this.

    For that reason, I can’t take any good pictures, but looking underneath with a loupe, it is clearly ETA 2453. The movement is marked ’30 jewels’, but I can find this specific movement only with 17/21/25 jewels in the Ranfft database and elsewhere. The ETA 2452 has a 30 jewels version, so I guess there is also a 2543 with 30 jewels.

    If there is an even (not uneven) number of jewels, how is that added up? I am not totally familiar with the positioning of all the jewels in a watch movement. Is it something that you specifically see on automatic watches (leaving aside all the misleading jewel counts)?
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  2. #2
    Vint. Forum Co-Moderator Mirius's Avatar
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Border-Reiver View Post
    I want to sort this Onsa automatic watch into my collection. It has an ETA movement which puzzles me a bit.

    First of all, it has this cursed ETA-disease of putting the caliber markings directly (I mean absolutely perpendicular) under the balance wheel, whatever the reason is for this idiotic positioning (see an authorized dealer to find out?). Yes, there are other manufacturers who have these markings in strange places, but ETA has made an art of this.
    Watch brand manufacturers don't want it too obvious that they have used an ebauche so the ebauche manufacturers have always been discrete with their markings.


  3. #3
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirius View Post
    Watch brand manufacturers don't want it too obvious that they have used an ebauche so the ebauche manufacturers have always been discrete with their markings.
    I see, that's even understandable, but you never know what ETA really has in mind... I would understand this better, if we would be talking about a marking on the outside of the watch. But once it's open anyway...

    Onsa has used lots of different movement manufacturers, not only from one country. Felsa was more visible on the movements for Onsa (perhaps just this particular one at a given time). I have to check through my other Onsa's.

    Whatever, how do these 30 jewels (even number) on the first watch add up?
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    Last edited by Border-Reiver; February 23rd, 2016 at 19:59.
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  5. #4
    Zenith Forum Co-moderator
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    17 will be in the ordinary "manual" movement (unless they used cap stones on the gears). The rest will be in the automatic winding system.

    Just because Ranfft doesn't list a 30 jewel version, it doesn't mean that none exists. It just means he hasn't come across it (or proven documentation of it). Alternatively, it might be an "upgrade" by the end user Onsa.

    Hartmut Richter
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  6. #5
    Vint. Forum Co-Moderator Mirius's Avatar
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    Back in the day you were lucky to find the calibre reference under the dial so I'd say it was a step forwards to have it visible at all.
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    17, as Hartmut mentioned, will be the standard bearings, pallets, impulse pin and capstones for the Incabloc. Capstones for the lever and escape wheel is 21. Bearings for the mainspring barrel is 23. 7 will be in the automatic module (2 for the reverser wheels and 5 for the rotor bearing would be my guess).
    Last edited by Vintage1982; February 23rd, 2016 at 21:57.
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  8. #7
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    I think ranfft is saying the 2453 is just a 2451 ,which also has up to 30 jewels, but with a single - material rotor . The 2452 has a date function.
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  9. #8
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    You could get what ever configuration you wanted as long as you were willing to pay. Certina even got ETA to not sign the base plates. Never seen this on other brands though.

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    Look no ETA 2783 under the balance.
    Last edited by Shum; February 24th, 2016 at 00:34.
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  10. #9
    Zenith Forum Co-moderator
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    I am not sure whether that movement ws unsigned or whether Certina just polished away the old engraving. I have a Baume & Mercier movement which is actually a Buren Cal. 1001A - and where the Buren logo (circle with triangularly arranged "BAA" in it) is in the original movement, there is a circular depression where B&M have drilled away any signs of foreign origin. The slightly upmarket brands were a little vain in that sense, and Certina, who used to make their own movements and had to "downgrade" by outsourcing that part of their watch manufacturing process, may have been the same.....

    Hartmut Richter

  11. #10
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    Re: Onsa / ETA movement – questions

    It's a model from around 1973/74 so it could be just as you say that they have removed ETA from the base plate. They didn't really start using ETA movements until late 70's on mass.

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