Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

Thread: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

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  1. #1

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    Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    Hello Everyone. To preface, in the past I have dealt with several Patak Philippe pocket watches but cannot claim to be an expert. Hence, my posting here to benefit by the wisdom of other members.

    I am currently in negotiations to purchase a Patek Philippe Chronograph pocket watch, whose pictures are attached. The movement is an older one and the seller states is marked PP with the serial number underneath the dial. From past experience with Patek Philippe pocket watches I know that they did put their mark and serial number underneath the dial on older pocket watches.

    Naturally, the seller is reluctant to remove the dial himself. Equally understandably, this makes me somewhat nervous.

    This watch has been recased.

    In the past when dealing with such pocket watches I have been acquainted with the seller or the watch was still in its original case marked by Patek Philippe, giving me some comfort. However, the seller in this case does offer me a full refund guarantee on the watch. Still it is better to be sure before buying than trying to get my money returned afterward.

    Importantly, the watch is not cheap. Neither would I expect it to be if everything is as it is represented.

    Attached are several photos of the movement which I hope the experts here can review and give me their opinions upon. Please tell me everything that you are able and offer as detailed an explanation of your views as possible.

    Thanks to everyone for their time and I really hope you can make up for my own ignorance on this watch. Take care.
    Attached Images Attached Images








  2. #2
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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    I am totally ignorant about the watch, but I would just like to say, that in I would not pay top $$ for a recased PP.

    Is it possible to have a pic of the dial?

    Also a pic of the inner caseback would be very useful. Is the case 14 or 18k gold?

  3. #3

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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    Thank you for your prompt reply to my post.

    To answer the previous questions:
    1. I'll try to get a photo of the dial in a day or two. It does say Patek Philippe & Cie (small underline beneath the ie) above the hands and Geneve beneath the hands. I am not in doubt about the authenticity of the dial.
    2. I'll also try to get a photo of the case, but that isn't very important to me. It is a sterling silver case. The value of the case is only as silver.

    My main concern on this is whether the movement is authentic.

    Thanks again and will try to get the photo up presently.

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  5. #4
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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    Ok, me (the Ignorasmus) again.
    WHY is a PP chrono movement cased in silver? Strange.
    This is not just a pocketwatch, it is a PP. and, not just ANY PP movement, it is suposedly a chrono PP!

    IMO, if this was my watch, and if the movement is legit, basically I would feel the need to send it to PP to have it properly recased (and serviced) . That is the only way to do it justice, and get the full value.

    That is in my opnion, of course others will soon chime in with their thoughts!
    Last edited by Janne; November 13th, 2009 at 23:36.

  6. #5

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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    Thanks, Janne. You've actually read my mind. If I decide to purchase I will send it to Patek to have it rejuvinated and properly cased. Just need to be sure on authenticity before I invest such a sum.
    Last edited by NewGuyWithOldPatek; November 14th, 2009 at 00:16.

  7. #6
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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    I tried to look on the finishing of the base movement. My laptop is too small to see if it is finished to PP standard. The parts of the chrono are not.
    But, what do I know?

    Edit: I am a total Idiot! Send an email to PP with the pics, they will tell you!!!

  8. #7

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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    That's a great idea. I had no idea they did such reviews. Perhaps they can shed some light on the matter, but I hope that everyone will continue to post their views / opinions / assessments of the movement. Thanks again!

  9. #8
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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    They do. they have the archives filled with all info they need to expertly not only see if it is Legit, but also to rebuild it as new condition!

  10. #9

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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    I've sent a letter to Patek in Switzerland asking them to review my photos. However, I strongly doubt they will do it for a variety of reasons. Not least of which, they won't want to be held liable for any kind of assurance either way on the watch. As for the archives, that costs 100 Swiss Francs and can take up to two months. Needless to say, that is not feasible under the circumstances.

    So if there are any other members opinions out there on the authenticity of this movement please post your comments. Also, please bear in mind that this movement is about 100 years old and has been recased so the finish will not appear as new. Anyway, I'm eager to hear any and all opinions. Thanks.
    Last edited by NewGuyWithOldPatek; November 14th, 2009 at 02:14. Reason: spelling error

  11. #10
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    Re: Patek philippe chronograph - opinions please!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by NewGuyWithOldPatek View Post
    I've sent a letter to Patek in Switzerland asking them to review my photos. However, I strongly doubt they will do it for a variety of reasons. Not least of which, they won't want to be held liable for any kind of assurance either way on the watch. As for the archives, that costs 100 Swiss Francs and can take up to two months. Needless to say, that is not feasible under the circumstances.

    So if there are any other members opinions out there on the authenticity of this movement please post your comments. Also, please bear in mind that this movement is about 100 years old and has been recased so the finish will not appear as new. Anyway, I'm eager to hear any and all opinions. Thanks.
    This is a plausible fake and not a good one. As far as I know, Patek Phillipe never made cylinder escapement watches, or at least, I have never seen one, and I've looked at quite a few auction catalogs. The balance, in particular is very pedestrian. There appear to be no timing screws and no temperature compensation screws, and the balance is not even a bimetallic balance.

    FAKE! The workmanship of the chrono mechanism seems average for a chronograph pocket watch, and there is no reasonable explanation for the watch to be recased.

    Also, the big question: Where is the Patek Phillipe signature on this watch? Or I should say, from this era, Patek & Philippe. I have not seen a unsigned Patek movement. Sorry, they do not exist.

    I'm going to take another look at your photos--it's impossible to go back and for between a post and the photos--and make some more comments.

    DON'T BUY IT!!

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