Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks
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  1. #1
    Member Jinx86's Avatar
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    Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Customer of mine brought this in looking to sell. I told him I would have to do some research on this, as I really have never seen one.

    Movement runs just by give the it a twist in hand. I removed hands and dial hoping for markings on the back side, but nothing there but a few numbers on the movement. Case is Stainless Steel and marked as such, nice enamel dial in pink and white with gold leaf, hands are solid gold.

    What would it cost to service such a movement and would it be worth it in the end. I want to pay my customer what its worth but don't want to be buried in it.

    <br><br><br><br>
    Last edited by Jinx86; May 26th, 2015 at 18:06.

  2. #2
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Hi
    I have one of these.
    First case will be nickel, I believe, a bit early for SS.

    They are cool pieces, but that one is mighty distressed, do you think you can restore it?

    They are not ultra valuable as very basic movements, mine is a cylinder escapement, but surely nice pieces

    Not sure like that its worth anything (to me)

    Regards
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

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  3. #3
    Member Jinx86's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Marking on inside of case is "Acier Garanti", would that be just steel and not stainless?
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  5. #4
    Member AbslomRob's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    I doubt it's Perpetual; it looks like "just" a triple date with moonphase. The calender works is in pretty rough shape though; you'd be looking at probably at least $500 to restore it, assuming that none of the parts are actually broken. The style looks early 1900's, and is based on a fairly standard ebauche that was widely available. Something like this was probably finished (and the calender functions added) by an independent watchmaker; complicated watches were one of the ways that Swiss watchmakers kept themselves in business once the American's took over the basic watch industry, since the market for complications was (at that time) too small to benefit from mass production.

    You'll probably never know who finished it, unless you get lucky and someone somehow recognizes the calender works based on a piece with more provenance.
    HOROLOGIST007 and SilkeN like this.
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  6. #5
    Member SilkeN's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    I don't know why but "Acier Garanti" usually is browned gunmetal/iron and not as the direct translation suspect steel in the sence of stainless steel. Maybe the meaning changes by the time.

    The movements are usually common raw movements were the maker add on the mechanismn on the dial side. I've seen a short while ago a very simular one with this bridge style and finish and it was marked by Georges Ducommun (later on Doxa) but I guess its just happenstance.

    Kind regards Silke
    Last edited by SilkeN; May 26th, 2015 at 18:52.
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  7. #6
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Correct, not perpetual, needs manually set for 28/29/30 days
    It always goes to 31
    Last edited by HOROLOGIST007; May 26th, 2015 at 19:47.
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

    "Failure is not an option" - Gene Kranz
    "Owning a vintage watch is great, understanding where it sits in Horology is magnificent"
    and
    "By Teaching Others, We Teach Ourselves"
    Adam

  8. #7
    Member Jinx86's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Forgot image of whole movement.
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  9. #8
    Vint. Forum Co-Moderator Mirius's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Clearly not a cylinder escapement. Not that it changes much I suspect.

    The only place that the American watch making ever dominated was America even for basic movements.
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  10. #9
    Member HOROLOGIST007's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirius View Post
    Clearly not a cylinder escapement. Not that it changes much I suspect.

    The only place that the American watch making ever dominated was America even for basic movements.
    I did say "mine" was cylinder escapement not OP
    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT. FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL. THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.

    "Failure is not an option" - Gene Kranz
    "Owning a vintage watch is great, understanding where it sits in Horology is magnificent"
    and
    "By Teaching Others, We Teach Ourselves"
    Adam

  11. #10
    Member SilkeN's Avatar
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    Re: Perpetual Date Pocket watch with no makers marks

    It is a quite rough made swiss leve movement with a effectively painted face. If you look on the ground plate you see the miling tracks. A solid simple movement with 15 jewels in former times. At least on the third wheel it s substituted against a bass bear (time typical ols repair). Also the weels for the date isn't fine jewelary but a nice function. Under the line its not a standart movement with this complication, very lovely and decorative. There is definetly a demand about those intersting and "play around" watches but these are no high end collectors.

    Kind regards Silke
    Mirius and radger like this.
    That's what I think about today:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlUGeY7MWVo

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