Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement
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  1. #1
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    Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Could not find in bidfun, catalogue oficiel nor in the linked websites in this forum

    The movement itself is 35mm size

    Chaos is my focus

  2. #2
    Member James A's Avatar
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Hi Laikrodukas,

    Most likely Valjoux base.

    Here is similar from Heuer



    Based on Valjoux 61



    https://heuerville.wordpress.com/201...1dec-c1930-38/



    Regards,

  3. #3
    Zenith Forum Co-moderator
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Hmmmmm. This is where we have to use a little imagination.

    I have no idea who actually made the movement in its present form. The balance cock shape, however, strongly reminds me of Orator. And when I look at this movement:

    bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: Orator 17.5'''

    ...it does rather look like at least the base movement. Not only the shape of the balance cock fits but also:

    - the shape of the lever cock
    - the exact positioning of the gears in the geartrain in relation to each other (angle between 2nd, 3rd and 4th gears >135)
    - positioning of the stem release screw

    Did Orator make this movement as a chronograph? Not necessarily. Sometimes, makers bought base movements and added their own chronograph mechanism (a modern example would be Habring, using the Unitas 6497). Also, I have no record of Orator making chronograph movements. However, that doesn't rule it out.

    And in the end, it might even not be an Orator movement at all.....

    Hartmut Richter
    esdy_11192 and laikrodukas like this.

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  5. #4
    Member esdy_11192's Avatar
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Hartmut, there is a little note from Dr Ranfft at your link that I guess you read:

    "The calibre was assigned to Orator due to the unique shapes of balance cock, regulator. Moreover a Chronograph Orator 497 with nearly the same base plate is known. But in other movement catalogues this calibre wasn't yet noticed."

    Might be this one. :)

  6. #5
    Zenith Forum Co-moderator
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Well spotted! No, I didn't see that (I was marginally short on time at the time). So it must be that or a related 16''' movement by Orator then.

    Hartmut Richter
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  7. #6
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    So I was spending my day clicking the internet :D

    Found one LIP
    Looks to have some similar constructions but still far away from a match

    Anyone got LIP caliber catalog? :D

    Chaos is my focus

  8. #7
    Zenith Forum Co-moderator
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    Sorry, a definite fail. Look at where the third gear is on both movements: in yours, it's covered by the main part of the chronograph clutch gear whereas in the LIP, it's inside that gear. Other differences:

    - the balance cock is completely different
    - the shape of the lever cock is completely different
    - the stem release screw is closer to the stem

    ...plus plenty more if you look hard enough.

    Hartmut Richter
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  9. #8
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    yup lots of differences, just that it has same similar levers
    but the one on the right is Valjoux 61 that James showed earlier
    maybe it really was a design inspiration for this obscure caliber
    Chaos is my focus

  10. #9
    Member esdy_11192's Avatar
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    If it's an Orator movement, I guess you would have something quite uncommon and rare. Maybe a look under the dial would help. What's the dial look like anyway? What's the brand of the watch?

  11. #10
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    Re: Pocket Chronograph could use help to identify the movement

    It's no brand at all :) Black dial, white markings
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    Chaos is my focus

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