Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?
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Thread: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

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  1. #1
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    Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    Hi Guys

    I searched for serviced watches and found this overseas seller with 100% and nearly 3,000 transactions.

    We are talking $ 40 as "BUY NOW" price. 'Crown and chrystal have been replaced, the watch underwent a general service'.

    If that service resembles the taking apart, cleaning, re-assembly and proper oiling of each part... then WOW! I'll try to bay the complete stock!

    But we become distrustful and suspicious. Maybe the watch case was cleaned, that's all?

    With the dial as guidance, what would be your take? Are there watch makers out there who might work for hours, then add maybe $ 20 to the price of a watch? In Germany, gas is > $ 5.50 but groceries usually cheaper.
    Am trying to save money by buying s e r v i c e d Vintage watches in future. Because we are talking $ 250 plus parts. Oh, 'crown and chrystal' have been replaced! All for $ 40? The man lives about 75 miles away, maybe I'll pay him a visit
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    Last edited by Kru Chris; December 26th, 2017 at 23:22. Reason: forgot the all important photo of the Junghans watch!

  2. #2
    Member Dan S's Avatar
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    Re: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    I am always skeptical when sellers say a watch has been serviced, and is still being sold very cheaply. I would need to be convinced. A service generally involves only the movement, not the dial. Specks like that on the dial are considered a part of patina, but not a desirable part. However, they cannot generally be removed without completely repainting the dial, which is also not desirable. As a matter of purely subjective opinion, I try to avoid watches like that. But if you like the way it looks, go ahead and buy it, but don't expect that it will be improved.
    -- Dan (formerly known as @badbackdan)
    ------- @oldwatchdan on Instagram -------

  3. #3
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    Re: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    You could save Your money for something that is not damaged like this one :)
    Junghans is very common in Germany, I bet You can hunt down Stainless Junghans Chronometer in some local shops or local ebay clones
    Chaos is my focus

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  5. #4
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    Re: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    "...good patina..." - an oxymoron for me. Do you enjoy damaged items? That's what it is - dial damage. That's not how the watch was designed to look. It's just random aging/damage from the environment or poor handling. Some aging is often to be expected on vintage watches but you need to decide for yourself what is acceptable, not get sucked into the gumpf about patina being desirable. In the main it is talked-up as desirable by sellers so that poor condition watches can be sold for more money.

    I'd also be very wary about what sort of service, if any, a watch had undergone that was being sold for $40. It doesn't really make economic sense for it to have been a complete and competent service.

    A redial, that is the stripping and repainting of a dial, is not generally now a normal part of a servicing of vintage watches. It's optional and up to the owner as to what they desire - a damaged original dial, or a redial which may or may not (generally not in my observations) conform to the original design, quality, and/or finish.
    Last edited by Gumby992; December 27th, 2017 at 10:07.

  6. #5
    Member Border-Reiver's Avatar
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    Re: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    Junghans (still around today) was once the largers producer of watches in the world. There are oodles of their vintage watches on the market, and certainly not in the top line of timepieces collected. Very reliable, simple and affordable - according to their target group when sold. A service for this watch (excluding parts) should not be as high as $250,00. Of course, it depends where you are located. In Germany, you could estimate about half of that or even less. Also, when it comes to spate parts, you easily would find them in Germany for most calibers.

    Just to give you an example: A 1950s Junghans watch (shown below) was worn by my Grandfather and later occasionally by my mother. It needed a new crystal and I gave it to my watchmaker. He told me, that the watch would also urgently need a service and a new crown, but that would not be justified considering the value of the watch. I told him about the background of this family heirloom and he went ahead. A few days later he told be, that it also needs a new balance staff, a spare part you can easily get on eBay or elsewhere, even from that production period. The total price for a COMPLETE service, a new crown and a new balance staff was around $110,00 equivalent. I have to mention, that he works a lot my 18th century pocket watches and better wristwatches, and therefore the price was very reasonable.

    One thing must also be mentioned. These Junghans watches, even into the 1950s, were heavily lumed with stuff that contains radium (hands, eventually numbers and/or dots). A lot of watchmakers refuse to work on those watches, others don't care or can take the necessary precautions. Amateurs should be careful when removing movements from watches, as some of the stuff (loosened and lying on the dial or at the corner to the case) can fall on your work bench or kitchen table and be picked up with your fingers and into your stomach with the next pizza.

    As suggested, you might want to save your money for something in better condition; and what concerns the dial (on your's), that leans more towards damage than patina.
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    Last edited by Border-Reiver; December 27th, 2017 at 22:06.
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  7. #6
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    Re: Are specs part of good patina? Should they get removed as part of a full revision service?

    Hi there,

    Quote Originally Posted by Gumby992 View Post
    ...Do you enjoy damaged items? That's what it is - dial damage.
    Clear words, unfortunately scarcely posted in this forum - thanks!

    Refering the header of the thread: Good patina does not exist, at best only acceptable patina. Of course I'm happy that for every grade of decay some enthousiasts are out there. So I can replace items with rotten dials by better specimen, just by declaring the decay as charming patina, when selling it.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft
    Last edited by Roland Ranfft; December 28th, 2017 at 14:20.
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