Vintage Clebar
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  1. #1
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    Vintage Clebar

    Hi guys I just bought this beautiful 1960's 2 register Clebar chrongraph with an original vintage unsigned beads of rice bracelet. I paid $750 for it which I think is reasonable does anyone think it is too expensive. It was a had to have deal for me.
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  2. #2
    Member LouS's Avatar
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Rather a good pickup in my opinion. But then I'm a sucker for beads of rice bracelets.

  3. #3
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Thanks LouS and I am also a sucker for a beads of rice bracelet. In fact I have started collecting vintage bracelets I was actually looking for one when I found this watch.....

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  5. #4
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Hi ladies,

    usually we don't discuss values here, but in this specal case I should mention that 750 bucks should buy you two or three n.o.s. samples instead of one with dubious movement condition.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft

  6. #5
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    I must admit, it looks nice from the outside, but I would not have paid that without a peek under the hood. It probably has a Landeron 149 (or variant thereof), which for mid-grade brands usually runs much less. I have a L149 in a Gallet flying officer, and it is a solid performer. If you are happy with the watch, then don't think twice about price paid.
    We usually suggest you having it fully serviced, even if it was never wound up and just sat in inventory, the lubricants have long since dried up.
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  7. #6
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Gents a few comments,
    I am not a rank amatuer in watch collecting I have been collecting and trading for 10 years now, and am meticulous in my research and choice of watches.
    Roland I make use of your pink pages as one of my trusted sources of reference. I apologise if discussing proce it taboo here I will ensure to never make that mistake again.
    As to the condition of the movement I have been assured by the previous owner that it was completely serviced by a proffesional watchmaker and has been verified as a Landeron 248 and is a very strong running movement with no issues at all.
    The value if a particular watch is a very subjective point I believe and is worth what it is to each individual based on its merits, in this case I am very happy with what I have paid for. It must be said that the beads of rice bracelet although unsigned is a very collectable item in its own regard with some pieces reaching $100 - 150 individually.

    DragonDan
    Thanks I am very happy with the watch and the cost and as a matter of course with all the vintage watches I buy I have my trusted watch maker service them and check them with a fine tooth comb

    Always nice to raise discussions and appreciate the comments.
    Last edited by Davy911; January 5th, 2012 at 14:49.

  8. #7
    Member Tony C.'s Avatar
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    While Roland's pronouncement is a bit harsh, I would always insist on a good photo of a movement irrespective of the claims made by the seller (or his watchmaker).

    Having said that, you can probably get a good feel for the market value of the watch by following the result of the auction linked below. It appears to be the same basic watch, though Zodiac branded (adding value), with a signed bracelet (also adding value), and yes, a movement shot.

    VINTAGE ZODIAC CLEBAR CHRONOGRAPH WRISTWATCH W ORIGINAL JB CHAMPION BAND 60S | eBay

  9. #8
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Hi Tony,

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony C. View Post
    While Roland's pronouncement is a bit harsh
    Why harsh? Here is the proof:
    http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-...sau&1268841618
    Steel case (no "ebay steel"), Landeron (with photo), better known brand, n.o.s.
    And believe me, my site is commonly regarded as expensive.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft

  10. #9
    Member Tony C.'s Avatar
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Hi Roland,

    I believe it was harsh because you are, in my view view, looking at the situation too mechanistically. By that I mean that one cannot assign a specific value to the aesthetic preferences of an individual, and the watch that you have submitted as "proof" has a dial that I, personally, wouldn't want at any price. Why? Because the luminous dots are (absurdly) applied right on top of the numbers below the hour markers. Either the luminous material was clumsily added some time after it left the factory, or the original design is eccentric, to phrase it kindly.

    So, in my view, the Clebar has a preferable dial, a preferable (and more valuable) bracelet, and is the better watch on balance. Was is worth two and a half times (not three, to be precise) the one on your site? Perhaps not, but I do not see the situation as being quite as clear-cut as you apparently do.

    All the best for the new year, and continues thanks for your excellent reference site.

    Tony C.

  11. #10
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    Re: Vintage Clebar

    Hi Tony,

    remember, in the 60s these watches had to be cheap (poor man's Breitling, Heuer etc.). So many manufacturers pulled cheap dials, movements, and cases off the shelf, and dropped their name on one or the other part - ready. Cheap or more politely economical meant: Dials designed in the 50s (no tool costs) usually not intended to apply lume, movements of course from Landeron, and actually only the better had all steel cases.

    From this time you'll hardly find any, where the lume wasn't dropped either on the scale (Clebar) or on the numbers (Golana). Of course it is a matter of taste, which imperfection is prefered. So finally the seller on my site had simply no luck to find at least two bidders, who were willing to pay a premium of $400 for bold lume dots, and leather straps instead of a 10-Dollar poorly fitting aftermarket rice bracelet.

    ...and a half times (not three, to be precise)
    Read twice: I wrote "two or three", and 750 / 301.67 makes 2.486, pretty near the average 2.5.

    And lets add this: Corrosion around the back of an else mint watch indicates ebay-steel.

    Regards, Roland Ranfft

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