What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer
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  1. #1
    Member Dan S's Avatar
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    What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    JLC Jaeger LeCoultre 37mm Memovox Worldtime K829 Bumper Automatic XL Steel Case | eBay

    The JLC Memovox jumbo is high on my wish list (although I'd prefer the no-date version), and the world-timer is particularly desirable to many people, but as we all know, there are many frankens and re-finished dials, etc. I'm pretty certain this one is a bad example, but it would be very educational for me if people could point out their specific concerns, and explain WHY they think this is a refinished dial. I'm trying to get better about recognizing the types of details that some of you are good at seeing. Just to be clear, the asking price is far too high in any case, so this is more an educational exercise than a watch I would pursue.

    (1) The condition seems to good to be true - but this is not proof.
    (2) The lume dots are all the same color, but this isn't proof of an complete re-dial, just new lume dots.
    (3) Some of the markers are not aligned with the lume dot circles (they are askew), suggesting they have been re-applied. Is this a reliable concern, or are some original dials imperfect in this way?
    (4) There is a funny extra ink mark above the "E" in "MEXICO". Looks like an error. Could this have been an original factory error?
    (5) The lume on the hands is too bright; this is obvious.
    (6) The back is over-polished, but this is just a condition issue.
    (7) Somebody has been very sloppy with a screwdriver when working on the movement. Lots of scratches. Again a condition issue.
    -- Dan (formerly known as @badbackdan)
    ------- @oldwatchdan on Instagram -------

  2. #2
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Far from an expert here but there seems too big a cosmetic difference between the inside and the outside of the watch. Dial too clean not to be a redial. Other things are there too but even to a non expert doesn't look right.

  3. #3
    Member Tony C.'s Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Total redial, and the WT disc is particularly obvious.
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  5. #4
    Member Dan S's Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony C. View Post
    Total redial, and the WT disc is particularly obvious.
    Tony, many thanks for this response. Can you give some details about how you can tell? I'm not doubting you at all, just trying to learn what to look for.
    -- Dan (formerly known as @badbackdan)
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  6. #5
    Member gatorcpa's Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Please look here for some examples that I believe to be correct:

    http://www.watchprosite.com/page-wf....some-pictures/

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    This one in particular shows the same inner dial with proper markings. The fact of the matter is that these are too easy to fake to have any value to me. Just doing a quick eBay search showed 3 fake inner dials currently for sale.

    Caveat Emptor on these!
    gatorcpa
    Last edited by gatorcpa; October 1st, 2016 at 01:22.
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  7. #6
    Member Tony C.'s Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Hi Dan –

    As @gatorcpa suggested, it's really a matter of gaining experience. When you've seen a fair number of correct dials, the redials jump out. And this particular model is hard to find with the original inner disc.

    While the design of the original one below is different, look at the quality and consistency of the printing on the names of the cities. A striking contrast to the one to which you linked.

    Cheers,

    Tony C.

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    Last edited by Tony C.; October 1st, 2016 at 02:12.

  8. #7
    Member Dan S's Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Many thanks Tony and Gator. I think that one take-home message for me is that in addition to the specific details I tend to look for, I also need to develop a more refined overall perception of quality. This will obviously require more research and experience, especially since quality and consistency varies a lot from one brand to another. For example, I have seen that some brands were much more careful with the quality/consistency of lume application than others.

    What is particularly difficult for me is that the quality of images on the internet varies tremendously. If I could always hold the watch in my hand and use a loupe, I think it would be a lot easier to distinguish the refinished dials. On the other hand, I don't want to eliminate from consideration every watch with poor photos, because I have learned from experience that sometimes there are really good deals to be had on fantastic watches with terrible photos.
    -- Dan (formerly known as @badbackdan)
    ------- @oldwatchdan on Instagram -------

  9. #8
    Member Tony C.'s Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    You have summed it up well, Dan. And I'm glad that you are aware of both sides of the coin, as good opportunities can indeed spring from poor quality seller's photos. Even in the case of better quality photos, though, a crystal in poor condition may reduce the final price significantly.

  10. #9
    Member gatorcpa's Avatar
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony C. View Post
    Even in the case of better quality photos, though, a crystal in poor condition may reduce the final price significantly.
    Which is why the best investment you can make is $8 for a tube of Polywatch and !1 for a 4-way women's nail sanding block.
    gatorcpa
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  11. #10
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    Re: What is wrong with this JLC memovox world-timer

    Things I spotted...
    Obvious redial. The biggest giveaway is the matt white finish. Then there's the quality of the lettering. "HongKong" Really? What did the Ho do to miss out on being emboldened? (Actually, it's probably better we don't consider what the Ho did!)
    Jaeger Le Coultre wording doesn't look centered under the JL logo.

    Then there's the difference between the interior and exterior. There is no way in hell that a watch with that amount of pitting around the case seal would be sporting an original dial in that condition.

    I'd be a little concerned by the movement too. The screws by (retaining) the two winders have been in and out a few times, they're chewed. But the screws on the bridge with the yellow lettering are pristine.

    Let's just say I wouldn't have bought it.

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