Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

Thread: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

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  1. #1
    Member Konrad's Avatar
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    Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    14 September 2009-I decided to observe the barometer and altitude readings of my three ProTreks as they were affected by different temperatures. Checking the forecast last evening showed this morning would be ideal. Temperatures during test period times ranged from 50.F to 70.F appx.. Relative humidity ranged from 20 to 40 per cent appx.. Barometer fairly steady, gentle rising trend continuing since late yesterday. For records of a local station see:

    http://www.wunderground.com/weathers...p?ID=KNVMINDE7

    Casio ProTrek models I used for observations:
    PRG-100 module 3022
    PRW-1300Y module 3070
    PRW-1100YTJ module 3042



    My actual home altitude measured by GPS is 4711 feet/ 1435.9 meters. In practice I use 4720 feet or 1435 meters to set my base altitude when I leave home and want altitude measurements. For the readings recorded today and listed below, I decided three days ago to remove all offsets and adjustments and set my three ProTreks to "OFF" for barometer and altitude. All three watches are set to Metric.

    All watches were placed with the sensors upright during the resting times.

    The first set of readings taken just before sunrise, the watches spent the night side-by-side on a window sill.
    100= 0608h 18.1C 1018hPa 1420m
    1300=0608h 18.3C 1018hPa 1440m
    1100=0608h 18.2C 1017hPa 1450m

    Second set of readings taken while 1100 worn on left wrist, 100 and 1300 worn on right wrist for 1.5 hours.
    100-=0743h 29.9C 1019hPa 1415m
    1300=0743h 29.5C 1018hPa 1440m
    1100= 0744h 30.2C 1019hPa 1435m

    Third set of readings were taken after the watches received 45 minutes of early morning low-angle sun sitting on a table four feet from an east-facing window.
    100= 0841h 38.8C 1018hPa 1420m
    1300=0842h 39.7C 1017hPa 1445m
    1100=0843h 39.8C 1019hPa 1430m

    Fourth set of readings taken after the watches spent 45 minutes outdoors facing the sun.
    100= 0949h 52.3C 1022hPa 1380m
    1300=0950h 55.5C 1022hPa 1405m
    1100=0951h 54.6C 1027hPa 1360m

    Fifth set of readings taken after watches rested indoors from heat test.
    100= 1059h 24.4C 1020hPa 1405m
    1300=1100h 24.5C 1019hPa 1430m
    1100=1102h 25.2C 1019hPa 1430m

    My conclusion is all three watch barometer sensors are affected by very hot temperatures [even when within the temp range specs], meaning none of these watches are compensated for heat changes.

    Konrad.
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    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions."

    -- GK Chesterton

  2. #2
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    Here is my take on it Konrad. This speculation on my part. I think Casio uses piezoresistive pressure sensors. These work based on the principal that a materials resistance changes when a mechanical force is apllied to it. Pressure and heat are both mechanical forces and both will change the resistance. The temperature of the watch is already measured and could be used in the program to correct the pressure reading if the resources (memory) were available. Either that or it is a lot easier for them to tell us to leave the watch on our wrists for accurate readings.

  3. #3
    Member zapiao's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    I m sorry but i dont agree with this tests !!!! I have the prg 100 and had readings of 32C in the wrist and the barometer remained in the same value as if it was on the table. That s why i love it because its very accurated even in the altimeter mode.
    I think that maybe it s the location of the sensor that its protected of wrist heat (my prg 70 has the sensor above north marking and the barometer readings are very afected by wrist heat). I love it !!!
    Last edited by zapiao; September 14th, 2009 at 23:48.

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  5. #4
    Member Konrad's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    No need to agree, we all have different watches, I reported only what I observed with my three ProTreks. My PRG100 appears very stable except when very hot, it fares quite well compared to my 1300 and 1100.

    Konrad.

    Quote Originally Posted by zapiao View Post
    I m sorry but i dont agree with this tests !!!! I have the prg 100 and had readings of 32C in the wrist and the barometer remained in the same value as if it was on the table. That s why i love it because its very accurated even in the altimeter mode.
    I think that maybe it s the location of the sensor that its protected of wrist heat (my prg 70 has the sensor above north marking and the barometer readings are very afected by wrist heat). I love it !!!
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    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions."

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  6. #5
    Member Konrad's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog15 View Post
    Here is my take on it Konrad. This speculation on my part. I think Casio uses piezoresistive pressure sensors. These work based on the principal that a materials resistance changes when a mechanical force is apllied to it. Pressure and heat are both mechanical forces and both will change the resistance. The temperature of the watch is already measured and could be used in the program to correct the pressure reading if the resources (memory) were available. Either that or it is a lot easier for them to tell us to leave the watch on our wrists for accurate readings.
    I read your link, thanks.

    I found this on a wikipedia article yesterday while trying to figure out what I was really trying to understand about sensors. Sort of like walking down a pitch black hallway for me.

    http://www.bosch-sensortec.com/conte...01July2008.pdf

    K.
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    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions."

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  7. #6
    Member Joakim Agren's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Konrad View Post
    I read your link, thanks.

    I found this on a wikipedia article yesterday while trying to figure out what I was really trying to understand about sensors. Sort of like walking down a pitch black hallway for me.

    http://www.bosch-sensortec.com/conte...01July2008.pdf

    K.
    Interesting, most interesting!

    I wonder why not Suunto or casio uses this Bosch sensor, it came out in July 2008 and seems to be superior in functionality (atleast for watches rated no more then 100M WR), very interesting to see that it has the temperature sensor built into the pressure sensor, thats a first, also the resolution of the altimeter function can be as low as 25cm or with software 10cm which is very impressive. Also it seems to draw much less power then older generation sensors which would be good for the battery and particular suitable for solar powered watches.
    The Water Resistance Myth VS Reality article:https://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=159142


  8. #7
    Member Queen6's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    I agree with Konrad`s findings, and you can find the links to my tests below. The later 1300`s are now equipped with a newer 3070(B) module as is the non "Atomic" PRG-110 with a 3071(B) module. I have an early PRW-1300-1V (3070) and it is definitely not thermal compensated and a late PRG-110-1V (3071(B)) and this ABC is extremely accurate. I also have a PRG-130 (non "Atomic" version of the 1500) and it too is not thermally compensated, which very much surprised me, two steps forward, one step back etc. My PRG-80`s have always been solid performers, indicating very good thermal tolerance, making Konrad`s result for the PRW-1100 disappointing.

    Why Casio has this hap hazard approach is beyond me, and the fact the they release very little technical detail does not help. If you look at the release order it makes even less sense with older ABC watches out performing new models. The change in module for the 1300 & 110 make sense as they were pretty inaccurate initially, however then to release the 1500 & 130 without thermally compensated sensors, is simply a step backwards.

    At the end of the day these are just individual watches, although I would encourage all with ABC`s to try similar tests, it will help understand the watches function and give you a better indication of the true accuracy, and a little fun thrown in.

    Casio are moving away from the specialist ABC and are really offering a quality multifunction watch with a level of ABC capability, and realistically this makes sense from a sales point of view as the watches will appeal to a much wider market, The new Timex WS4 may be a more accurate ABC with greater functionality, however looks for looks in comparison the latest Casio PRW-2000 it is simply a brute and very much relegated to field use.

    Are Protrek`s Accurate #1
    Are Protrek`s Accurate #2

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  9. #8
    Member Seamaster73's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    Do we know if the PRW-2000 is compensated?

  10. #9
    Member Konrad's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    My Dec. 2008 PRW1300Y came with a 3070[B] manual, yet the case back is marked 3070; I wonder if the 'change' is simply in the manual and not in the module?

    The PRW1100 performed fine except for the very extreme heat result. Perhaps the mostly titanium absorbed more heat than the plastic/resin ones?

    It seems my ProTreks work fine at most high temps until one gets over 50C, even though the specified range for ops is stated in the manual as -10 to 60C.

    I'll have to wait until January to do some cold tests of my three ProTreks.

    Konrad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Queen6 View Post
    I agree with Konrad`s findings, and you can find the links to my tests below. The later 1300`s are now equipped with a newer 3070(B) module as is the non "Atomic" PRG-110 with a 3071(B) module. I have an early PRW-1300-1V (3070) and it is definitely not thermal compensated and a late PRG-110-1V (3071(B)) and this ABC is extremely accurate. I also have a PRG-130 (non "Atomic" version of the 1500) and it too is not thermally compensated, which very much surprised me, two steps forward, one step back etc. My PRG-80`s have always been solid performers, indicating very good thermal tolerance, making Konrad`s result for the PRW-1100 disappointing.


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    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions."

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  11. #10
    Member Konrad's Avatar
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    Re: Casio PRWG100/PRW1300Y/PRW1100YTJ not temperature compensated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamaster73 View Post
    Do we know if the PRW-2000 is compensated?
    I'm beginning to think the answer is in the software rather than in any physical or mechanical solution.

    What does "compensated" mean to you, and why do you think it is important?

    Konrad.
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    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions."

    -- GK Chesterton

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