"Overpriced"--A Rant

Thread: "Overpriced"--A Rant

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  1. #1
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    "Overpriced"--A Rant

    I frequently read on the various forums here statements of bare (and often uninformed) opinion, stated as fact. Generally, I understand that this is the internet, and that many aren't careful enough to separate fact from opinion. And generally I don't much care.

    But the label of "overpriced" is tossed around here like a curse, apparently only because a particular watch, or brand, costs more than that particular person cares to (most likely, can) pay for it.

    And, most often, this label is smeared on Rolex.

    Now, as background, I'm no fan of Rolex. I'm not against spending absurd amounts of money on a watch, as my little "collection" shows, but nothing about Rolex appeals to me, and much about Rolex repels me. It is more likely that cold lemonade will be on the menu in the nether regions than that I ever will own a Rolex.

    But. Almost all watches are luxury items; cell phones keep better time than most of our watches, and most of us carry a cell phone. So, by definition, the proper price for a watch is what the public, in enough number to support that price point for that watch, is willing to pay. Thus, by definition, a watch, or brand, that sells in large numbers (enough to show a profit, for instance), is not overpriced.

    Now, back to Rolex. They are a mighty marketing machine, having successfully convinced a large part of the world that their products are the be-all/end-all of horology. And they are, in fact, fine little machines, by any objective standards. The fact that I'm not a fan doesn't change any of that. Rolex sells close to a million watches each and every year, and has revenues in the billions of US dollars.

    It is, therefore, by any rational standards, utterly absurd to call a Rolex "overpriced." Or any other of the many fine timepieces so-labeled by so many on this site. It's fine to say "I wouldn't pay that much for that watch," or anything equivalent, but the label of "overpriced" is just absurd, unless you can show that is isn't selling in enough numbers to support itself.
    [/rant]
    Mark
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  2. #2
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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Agreed, but I think what most folks are trying to get across is that "Overpriced" implies you are paying for something other than the object itself. A finely crafted watch has a certain value due to all the inputs required to make a beautiful horological device. Beyond that is marketing. Brands like Rolex add value to their product through marketing, not through adding actual value to their products. There isn't anything wrong with this, it happens with everything. Why pay $60 for a Ralph Lauren shirt when pretty much the exact same shirt can be had at Target for $12. You are paying for the brand.

  3. #3
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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Good rant! I don't necessarily agree (I think 'overpriced' is more subjective than that) but it's great to see some strong opinions on here from time to time.

    This forum would be a better place with more rants and fewer "should I buy a or b" threads!

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  5. #4
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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Excellent rant Mark and one I completely concur with. I'm on record as defending Rolex's pricing even though I don't particularly like most of their models. How many brands can you show me that have several models in their line-up under $10,000 that are in-house movements? If you're good, you might get to your second hand using fingers to add them up. One could make the argument that ANY watch over $20 is overpriced.

    Secondly, you are correct about the blurred line between opinion and fact. Sadly, members like you & I who do have somewhat informed opinions and actually pay attention to history and recent trends without blindly pledging allegiance to a particular brand will always have a hard time making a case against a fanboy. You can't win a debate with a fanatic because they only see 'truth' as their point of view..... yet we still bang our heads against a wall trying to explain the other side of the coin with logic and examples.

    You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
    You can lead a person to reason but you can't make them think.

    The only solution I've found is to take a break or don't read the particular forum where the most offenders are located. I've taken two in recent months, and other long-time members have as well.

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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    I might be feeding a troll, but still...

    "Overpriced" is a statement of fact, not libel. People use this word to describe a disparity between what something should/could cost and what it really costs, not to "smear" something.

    When you say that they sell a million watches and have revenues in billions of dollars, a simple (and naive) calculation would mean that they earn a couple of thousands for each watch sold. They are obviously rather wealthy, almost every magazine has their ads, they sponsor lots of sports events... You don't get that kind of money by selling things for barely more than it costs you to make them. It is just a part of their business model - advertise to rich and famous, sell for whatever they will pay, put money into advertising...

    Saying that something is overpriced isn't equivalent to saying it is worthless, just that it costs more than what you think it should cost.

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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Quote Originally Posted by horrovac View Post
    I might be feeding a troll, but still...

    "Overpriced" is a statement of fact, not libel. People use this word to describe a disparity between what something should/could cost and what it really costs, not to "smear" something.

    When you say that they sell a million watches and have revenues in billions of dollars, a simple (and naive) calculation would mean that they earn a couple of thousands for each watch sold. They are obviously rather wealthy, almost every magazine has their ads, they sponsor lots of sports events... You don't get that kind of money by selling things for barely more than it costs you to make them. It is just a part of their business model - advertise to rich and famous, sell for whatever they will pay, put money into advertising...

    Saying that something is overpriced isn't equivalent to saying it is worthless, just that it costs more than what you think it should cost.
    Respectfully, I think this definition can only apply if you define "overpriced" as that price over and above cost of goods. Does not compute, IMO. I think there must be _some_ degree of subjective analysis used to determine what is, or is not, overpriced.

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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Quote Originally Posted by ulackfocus View Post
    Secondly, you are correct about the blurred line between opinion and fact. Sadly, members like you & I who do have somewhat informed opinions and actually pay attention to history and recent trends without blindly pledging allegiance to a particular brand will always have a hard time making a case against a fanboy. You can't win a debate with a fanatic because they only see 'truth' as their point of view..... yet we still bang our heads against a wall trying to explain the other side of the coin with logic and examples.
    I don't really get this.

    It's the internet, and a discussion forum. Is it really necessary to preface every single phrase with IMO? It's pretty much assumed that we are mostly just watch enthusiasts with opinions on watches and watch related matters.

    Where I could see there being a problem is with somebody saing that the 2824 has 17 jewels. Whehter that is an opinon or not, who knows, who cares, but it is obviously wrong (I'm no philosopher). And somebody like ULF or Lysander will quickypoint out the error anyway.

    But other than that type of thing, most of what we post are opinions. Some are justified in a way that speaks to youpersonally more than others, so you are more likely to consider that to be the more valid opinion. But it's still an opinion.

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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Quote Originally Posted by mattjmcd View Post
    Respectfully, I think this definition can only apply if you define "overpriced" as that price over and above cost of goods. Does not compute, IMO. I think there must be _some_ degree of subjective analysis used to determine what is, or is not, overpriced.
    I factor in the price of comparable products to determine whether something is overpriced or not. Or even the same product in different markets. There are watches which sell for $600 here in Australia, and $400 elsewhere (and $200 on the bay). Therefore I consider the watch here in Australia is overpriced, even though rubes are buying them.

  10. #9
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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    On a purely economical definition, you're absolutely correct. Nothing can be overpriced if they are selling at that price in sufficient numbers.
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    Re: "Overpriced"--A Rant

    Quote Originally Posted by jason_recliner View Post
    I factor in the price of comparable products to determine whether something is overpriced or not. Or even the same product in different markets. There are watches which sell for $600 here in Australia, and $400 elsewhere (and $200 on the bay). Therefore I consider the watch here in Australia is overpriced, even though rubes are buying them.

    Your own version of the Big Mac test, I see?
    TAG Heuer Monaco LE|Omega Speedmaster|Seamaster 300MC|Rolex Submariner|Tudor Ranger

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