Still having to wind an automatic Panerai
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  1. #1
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    Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    Hi Guys,

    I'm just reaching out to see what the frequency is and wonder why I still have to manually wind my automatic Panerai every few days and if it's normal?

    I wear it about 10 hours or so a day while at the office, it gets decent movement during the day, I am up and down all day long and running back and forth between meetings so it's not as though it sits idle.

    Part of the intrigue of the automatic movement is that you don't have to wind it but I find myself winding it every few days. Is this normal? My other automatic watch (low end Burett) almost never requires winding...from a month of being idle, I can put it on and shake my wrist enough to get it going and usually it continues to go. The Burrett has an ETA 2824 movement, for the record.

    Anyone else with a P.9001 movement or any Panerai automatic movement that requires manual winding on a regular basis?

    Am I not moving enough to self wind it?

    Is this normal?

    How much movement is required to continue to wind the watch without actually screwing the crown?

  2. #2
    Member Shutterbug57's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    I had a similar issue with my Breitling Transocean Day/Date. I had to send it back to Breitling twice. The second time it went with very specific notes on how it behaved and how other watches behaved in the same circumstances. That gave the techs what they needed to fix the issue. Mine was a problem with the rotor and a couple of other parts in the automatic wind train. Mine would run for the full reserve if fully wound, but would not hold a charge overnight from just wear. Sounds similar to what you are experiencing. It is a pain, but can be fixed.

  3. #3
    Member Shutterbug57's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    FWIW, here is the letter I sent.

    18 May 2015

    Breitling USA Inc.
    Hangar 7
    206 Danbury Road
    Wilton, CT 06897

    To Whom it May Concern:

    Please find enclosed my Breitling Transocean Day & Date watch. I really like this watch, but it fails to live up to the standards Breitling established for it – its automatic function does not fully wind the watch. I have gathered some evidence as shown below:

    Observation 1 – Manually winding the watch provides a fully wound watch. On 8 May 2015, at 00:00 hours, I fully wound the watch manually. I then let it sit until it died on 8 May at 17:05 hours – 41 hours later. I realize that this is not up to the 42 hour spec, but I am fine with the 41 hour metric.

    Observation 2 – Wearing the Transocean and daily observations
    11 May 2015 – wore the Transocean for the day, about 14 hours and it ran through the night.
    12 May 2015 – wore the Transocean for the day about 10 hours taking it off at 18:00 hours to mow the yard. It ran until 22:43 hours or about 4.75 hours.
    13 May 2015 – set and wore the Transocean for 14.5 hours and set it down until it died at 16:17 the following day – 17.75 hours
    14 May 2015 – set and wore my Tag Heuer 2000 for about 12 hours setting it down at 22:00 hours. It was dead when I put it on and after setting it down, it ran until 15:40 hours on the 16th or 41.75 hours. This was a benchmark test as I was doing the same daily tasks that I had been doing in my Transocean.
    15 May 2010 – set and wore the Transocean for about 14 hours, putting it down at 21:00 hours – it died at 04:55 – roughly 8 hours later.
    16 May 2015 – set and wore my Baume & Mercier Capeland all day. Put it down at 22:00 hours and it is still running at this writing (18 May 2015 @ 08:00 hours).
    17 May 2015 – set and wore the Transocean. This was a weekend day and I was minding an 18 month old, so pretty active – more active than usual. I wore the watch for about 14 hours putting it down at 22:00 hours. It died at 03:43 overnight – 5.75 hours later.

    Other Observations:
    The performance noted above from my Tag Heuer 2000 and Baume & Mercier Capeland is representative of all my watches except the Breitling Transocean. All of my other watches: Rolex Submariner, Baume & Mercier Capeland, Tag Heuer 2000, Tag Heuer Formula 1 Calibre 16, & Tissot Ballade III are capable of being worn from dead for a day, Friday, being set down for Saturday and still being good to go without having died on Sunday morning. With a quoted 42 hour reserve on the Breitling Transocean, I expected similar results, this has not happened.

    When running and put on an Orbita watch winder with the proper settings, if left on the winder for a couple of weeks, the watch will lose a few days.

    This watch qualifies for frequent traveler status. This is the third time it has been returned for warranty work and the second time for this issue. Please take the time to fully evaluate the root cause for the watch’s poor performance and make the requisite changes to ensure that it performs as designed and expected. As noted above, I really like this watch and its design, but I am disappointed that it has been such a hassle so far. It works fine as a manual wind watch, but that is not what I bought, nor consistent with your product specs for this watch.

    I appreciate your help in resolving this warranty matter. Please feel free to contact me at the below number/ e-mail address/ address if needed.
    liwang22 and BarracksSi like this.

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  5. #4
    Member sticky's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    Some movements are are more "lazy" than others when it comes to converting movement to power. I fidget and twitch enough to keep my watches in a high state of power reserve but there was just one SW220 that would stop on me if I was uber sloth like for a day. It could be that you're just not wafting the watch about enough to put a good charge in it

  6. #5
    Member Likestheshiny's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    Ten hours a day would be right on the border for me -- I'd probably need to wind every few days unless I'd been especially active. The assumption with an auto is that you're wearing it all day, not just putting it on in the morning and taking it off after work.

  7. #6
    Member Lex Tempus's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    I though I would chime in. While an automatic watch does not require you to wind the watch while you are wearing it, it helps to understand how the mechanism functions, and how a traditional mainspring behaves. As you know, there is a weighted rotor that swings in automatic movements. This motion does "charge", or add energy to, the mainspring. However, as mentioned in a previous reply to this thread, not all rotors are created equal. Some wind only in one direction, some in both, some are very heavy, some are light, some are connected to heavy gear trains, some are not. As such, each one will charge its respective mainspring differently. However the rotor is made, one thing is always true; a rotor will never be as efficient at winding your watch, as the crown. Wearing an automatic watch will keep it wound while it is on your wrist, but once you take it off, you are relying on the energy you stored throughout the day. If the watch didn't start the day fully charged, it will rarely end the day that way, so the mainspring will slowly eventually completely unwind.

    To complicate things, mainsprings have a little idiosyncrasy. The first 75-ish% of its charge will be the most accurate. The last 25% will often cause the watch to speed up, slightly. As such, it is important for your timekeeping to make sure your watch is as close to fully wound as possible, every time you wear it. If you do not give your watch a full wind in the morning, you don't know if you are sitting at the last 25% (although you may be early to things).

    In other words, an automatic timepiece can buy you some time before the inevitable winding of the crown. However, for the best results with any watch, it is always recommended to give it a few winds every day. Many collectors actually enjoy this moment you spend with your watch. It gives you a moment to connect with past, and appreciate the centuries of brilliance that led to the seemly simple mechanism on your wrist. All too often today, we get too busy to appreciate things like that.
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    Mark Baran
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  8. #7
    Moderator Public Forum John MS's Avatar
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    Re: Still having to wind an automatic Panerai

    Quote Originally Posted by jayb1314 View Post
    Hi Guys,

    I'm just reaching out to see what the frequency is and wonder why I still have to manually wind my automatic Panerai every few days and if it's normal?

    I wear it about 10 hours or so a day while at the office, it gets decent movement during the day, I am up and down all day long and running back and forth between meetings so it's not as though it sits idle.

    Part of the intrigue of the automatic movement is that you don't have to wind it but I find myself winding it every few days. Is this normal? My other automatic watch (low end Burett) almost never requires winding...from a month of being idle, I can put it on and shake my wrist enough to get it going and usually it continues to go. The Burrett has an ETA 2824 movement, for the record.

    Anyone else with a P.9001 movement or any Panerai automatic movement that requires manual winding on a regular basis?

    Am I not moving enough to self wind it?

    Is this normal?

    How much movement is required to continue to wind the watch without actually screwing the crown?
    If there are some times that the Burrett won't build a sufficient power reserve from arm winding I think you may not be moving that arm quite as much as you think. One other possibility is that the Panerai is due for a servicing.

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