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Are watches from online shops that are "discounted" legit?

5K views 35 replies 19 participants last post by  Medusa 
#1 ·
Newbie here just getting my feet wet with watch collecting as a hobby. Due to my Ducati, Nikon, cigars, scotch, and classic VW interests this isn't going to be a full-on deep dive into collecting but watches have always been a careful consideration for me when purchasing ...plus I'm not wealthy by any means, I just shop carefully...most of the time :-d I plan on doing some of my own work (the simple stuff like battery & strap changes for now) as I'm very mechanically inclined -- if you own a classic VW it comes with the territory, LOL ;-)

My question: I've seen some on-line sites that sell watches and some claim pretty decent sale prices vs. manufacturer's suggested price. A good example is World of Watches. I'm intrigued but cautious. Are these legit prices or are they simply stating what the going price actually is?
 
#2 ·
Yes. The Gray Market dealers and authorized discount dealers sell legit stuff. You'll miss out on a warranty with the gray market, but I don't know how the new WoW is currently (they just went through a change of ownership.)

Keep in mind that some MSRPs are extremely fanciful prices you'll never pay and the profit margin for an authorized dealer can be very high-- giving the AD negotiating room, but if they have to dump a watch on to the gray market for just over their cost, you'll see just how high the markup can sometimes be.

Welcome!
 
#3 ·
A well known grey market dealer is Ashford. Most of the brands have their dealer warranty, not the original brand warranty. However! Interestingly in their shop Rado has the brand warranty and I think Zenith as well!

Bought this beauty for around $1000 at black friday 2 years ago at Ashford. Incredibly nicely made for the price:

 
#4 ·
Oh geez, I wasn't aware that such watches would be grey market! I'm familiar with that about cameras but didn't even consider it for such places. So that leads to another question, how does one know if a watch is being sold grey market or not?
 
#16 ·
There is a big difference between GM watches and GM camera gear, which is usually imported from another country. Not only do you not get a warranty with say a GM Nikon D850, but Nikon USA will not service it. You'd have to send it back to its country of origin and have it serviced there. GM watches aren't like that at all. An authorized Omega service center would be happy to service a GM watch, or you could have any competent watchmaker do it. What you don't get (usually) is a factory warranty. The "warranty" you do get instead from places like Joma aren't worth the paper they are printed on. Never ever send a watch back to a GM dealer for warranty work.

Also, hey Portland! If you haven't already been, check out Alex & Co. on 10th. Very friendly folks, and they usually have some pretty cool inventory.
 
#6 ·
I got burned once. I brought an Omega Seamaster from a big grey market seller back in 2005 that turned out to be a fake. I posted my experience on TZ, and a few months later, I received a letter from their lawyer threatening to sue and demanding that I delete my post.

I’ll only consider buying from the grey market, IF the seller can provide the warranty card. In my experience, I’ve received just as good if not better deals at local AD’s, where I have an established relationship with, so there’s no reason for me to go grey.
 
#12 ·
Gray market dealers will vary. Ashford and Jomashop are two of the bigger ones. I've purchased from both with zero problems (and as mentioned above, Ashford actually is an AD for a few brands).

One thing to consider buying gray market is that you should pretty much forget any service options through them. Yes, they will advertise a "warranty", usually performed by a third party. Results of using those warranties are (shall we say) mixed at best. In my mind, I buy gray market when the savings will pay for one service at a competent watchmaker, if needed. Usually, given the absurd prices charged by many ADs, it's not hard to save that much via gray market. And I've yet to have a watch need service within the typical manufacturer's warranty period, so I'm way ahead on that count.

If/when you buy gray market, give it a good inspection and let it run a couple of days before removing any packaging or using it in any way. That way, if something is wrong, you can just do a return/refund. Much easier than trying to deal with them later.

And finally, the larger gray market dealers do not sell fake watches. If they did, they wouldn't be in business long. Best thing to do is ask around here for experiences. Good luck!
 
#14 ·
One thing to consider buying gray market is that you should pretty much forget any service options through them. Yes, they will advertise a "warranty", usually performed by a third party. Results of using those warranties are (shall we say) mixed at best. In my mind, I buy gray market when the savings will pay for one service at a competent watchmaker, if needed. Usually, given the absurd prices charged by many ADs, it's not hard to save that much via gray market. And I've yet to have a watch need service within the typical manufacturer's warranty period, so I'm way ahead on that count.

If/when you buy gray market, give it a good inspection and let it run a couple of days before removing any packaging or using it in any way. That way, if something is wrong, you can just do a return/refund. Much easier than trying to deal with them later.
Couldn't have said it better myself. This is exactly what's in my head whenever I purchase from the Grey market. And i'll add this; I've owned quite a few watches over the las 20 years, sold more than I've owned, but owned a lot nonetheless and I have never had a watch that needed servicing due to a failure for some sort. I understand that this is most likely a mix of luck and quality as some of the most expensive watches can fail in one way or another, but my point is that I have never really much worried about guarantees when it comes to watches.
 
#13 ·
If a dealer is an AD they will be listed on the manufacturers web site and if not it’s a fair bet that they are grey. If you follow the forums for a bit you’ll soon get an idea who the big players are when it comes to respected grey dealers and if you are still not sure you can always ask here.
 
#15 ·
Cool, thanks gents!
 
#18 ·
It’s so much easier to buy gray market now. You can even pull up watchuseek forum discussions on specific sellers. Buy it from a warrantied online seller or trusted seller on chrono24, get a local service center to open it up and voila! You’re done. But since you’re just getting into it, really depends on the model you’re looking to buy.
 
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#19 ·
When buying watches of any significant value I believe it is preferable by far to buy a new watch from an AD or a used watch from a well trusted seller. I would rather pay a bit more, or wait a bit longer than buy a watch from a grey. Patience is usually rewarded in the world of watches while impatience often leads to regrettable decisions.
 
#23 ·
I'm getting back into watches after a spell being out too. I've learned that some manufacturers have a 'boutique' where they sell their own products and quite often their authorized dealers are in a jewelry store.

However, just because you are in a jewelry store, and they have some of a particular watch brand in the case, that does not necessarily mean that they are an authorized dealer. I was in a local jewelry store that had a large display of Citizen, and a few Tag's .... I asked and they said they were not a Tag Heuer dealer.

Anyone with more experience than I , please feel free to correct anything I said that I was wrong about ... I too, am still learning the in's and out's of watch buying.
 
#29 ·
Everyone, thanks for your advice and recommendations on grey market sellers.
 
#30 ·
I think there's something to be said about how much one is spending and the comfort level of the purchase. Jomashop, for example, has some seriously expensive watches on there, like over a hundred grand and I'd think if one is spending that kind of money, it's more reassuring to be dealing with an AD, in person, with a security team standing by, haha.

But, I think the grey market for "affordable" up to mid-range stuff is pretty sweet, since it very often means being able to afford something that might otherwise just live on a wish list. Plus, some incredible deals do pop up, and saving forty or fifty percent or more is hard to pass up. Why pay more, if one doesn't have to? For me, the grey market has meant far more purchases and I don't have a lot of AD's around anyway for brands or models I like, so the Internet has been a huge resource for the watch hobby. Dealing with AD's isn't always going to give a discount anyway, in AD's I've dealt with, who won't match anywhere near what I can find online, and, considering I've never been burnt and none of my watches have required servicing under warranty, it has seemed more than worth it.

And, yes, MSRP's can be inflated, of course, to make it seem like it's a great deal, but certainly grey is a savings over AD's, a no brainer there, and I've been very happy with how much I've saved.

I've dealt with Jomashop, Certified Watch Store, Long Island Watches, Creation Watches, World of Watches, Discount Watch Store, Overstock, Amazon, and others, and have been happy every time. As has been pointed out, if any of these places were in the business of selling fakes, they wouldn't still be around, especially in this day and age where there's nowhere to hide in the marketplace with a sour reputation.

Sites can easily be researched, and any search like "is Jomashop (or whoever) safe?" will provide plenty of reliable feedback. Welcome to the happy madness of this hobby!
 
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