Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)
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Thread: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

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  1. #1
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    Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Hello Forum,

    I recently bought a Save the Ocean Samurai and I was wondering if it's possible to change out the dial for the Save the Ocean Turtle one?

    I asked Seiko customer care in UK but they didn't seem to know what they were talking about. They said it's not possible because the movements are different sizes and one has a day wheel. It's no use talking to the boutique in London where I bought the watch because they couldn't even pronounce Seiko correctly.

    The plan would be to get my hands on the entire 4R36 movement and dial from a Turtle, and plop it into the Samurai case. Is this technically feasible? Do I even need to do that? Could I just put the day wheel and dial on the 4R35 from the Samurai?

    I looked online and it seems the 4R35 and 4R36 are the same exact size (27mm). The only difference I can see is the crown position. But can you just rotate the whole 4R36 movement counterclockwise to put the crown in the 3 O'clock position (Samurai position), and rotate the dial to make up for the offset?

    Please excuse my ignorance, I am new to the watch world!

    Regards,

    Mike

  2. #2
    Member Seiko Madness's Avatar
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    The fact that the Samurai does not have the week day while the turtle has make things I little harder.

    I am not 100% sure, but I think I got the answer. Details below.

    (1) Maybe you can add a day wheel to the 4R35. I guess that can be done, but I am not sure about this. If that is indeed possible, then all you will need to do is to get the dial and the day wheel and find a watchmaker worth of the title to carry out the job.

    If (1) is not possible, then you have to do the following:

    (2) Since the Samurai movement does not have the day, you will need to replace the movement too.

    (3) Instead of buying the 4R36, buy a NH36. It is exactly the same movement, but it is cheaper. As far as I know, the only difference is the Seiko stamp. Both movements are from Seiko. The one labeled 4R36 is used in Seiko watches, while the NH36 is sold to other watch brands.

    (4) You can get a NH36 at Ebay.

    (5) The problem is to get a NH36 with the 4 o'clock crown. I think it is hard. Hence, you need to get the 3 o'clock and purchase the day and date wheels separately. A minor comment: you may manage to use the date wheel from the Samurai; however, you still need to get the day wheel.

    Let's see what the others have to say.
    My name is Madness; Seiko Madness.

  3. #3
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    You bought a Samurai from the boutique? You know you can get these for the best part of £100 cheaper than RRP and sometimes more a lot of the time right?
    ewewew likes this.

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  5. #4
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seiko Madness View Post
    The fact that the Samurai does not have the week day while the turtle has make things I little harder.

    I am not 100% sure, but I think I got the answer. Details below.

    (1) Maybe you can add a day wheel to the 4R35. I guess that can be done, but I am not sure about this. If that is indeed possible, then all you will need to do is to get the dial and the day wheel and find a watchmaker worth of the title to carry out the job.

    If (1) is not possible, then you have to do the following:

    (2) Since the Samurai movement does not have the day, you will need to replace the movement too.

    (3) Instead of buying the 4R36, buy a NH36. It is exactly the same movement, but it is cheaper. As far as I know, the only difference is the Seiko stamp. Both movements are from Seiko. The one labeled 4R36 is used in Seiko watches, while the NH36 is sold to other watch brands.

    (4) You can get a NH36 at Ebay.

    (5) The problem is to get a NH36 with the 4 o'clock crown. I think it is hard. Hence, you need to get the 3 o'clock and purchase the day and date wheels separately. A minor comment: you may manage to use the date wheel from the Samurai; however, you still need to get the day wheel.

    Let's see what the others have to say.
    Thanks for the info. Some stuff to think about.
    I'm fairly sure there is a way to do this.

  6. #5
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Quote Originally Posted by clyde_frog View Post
    You bought a Samurai from the boutique? You know you can get these for the best part of £100 cheaper than RRP and sometimes more a lot of the time right?
    Not sure how this helps my question. Please re-read.

  7. #6
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    If you get a movement and dial from a turtle you'll have to at least cut the crown stem down to fit. As it goes from 4:00 to 3:00, the crown gets closer to the movement and it would stick out if you don't shorten the stem. Make sure the crown fits the Samurai's guards too. The other bigger question is why? The dials are so similar and for the cost of getting a new movement and dial from a turtle, I'm not sure why you would bother.
    ewewew likes this.

  8. #7
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Hi Jeff,

    It's about having something unique for me. The only difference I care about is having a day wheel on the Samurai. It's more aesthetically pleasing to me, and I'd hazard a guess it would be the only one around.

    Thanks for the advice though, I'll bear it in mind.

    Regards,

    Mike

  9. #8
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Just replied a week ago about the same situation here: https://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/po...l-5087505.html

    The movements are pretty much the same, except that the 4R36 has a shorter metal hub or whatever it's called, to accommodate the day wheel and C-clip. If you do get your hands on the Turtle dial + movement, it will fit in the Samurai case and you can just use the crown & stem from the Samurai. But keep in mind that the dial will be tilted to the side, and to fix that you will have to pull off the hands, remove the dial, clip the dial feet, file it smooth, adhere the dial to the movement, and re-set the hands. You will also have to replace the 4 o'clock day wheel with a 3 o'clock wheel, otherwise the day won't line up in the window correctly.

    If you want to put a day wheel on the 4R35, you will have to disassemble a few layers of the movement to replace that metal hub I mentioned, to accommodate the wheel. And of course, you will need to source the hub from a donor movement and a 3 o'clock day wheel. With day wheels going for $17-$20, you might want to consider buying a new NH36 3 o'clock movement (unbranded 4R36), going for $30-$45 on ebay. You'll also need to swap the standard movement holder of the 4R36 for the taller movement holder from the Samurai.
    Last edited by heywatchit!!; 4 Weeks Ago at 14:07.
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  10. #9
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Quote Originally Posted by heywatchit!! View Post
    Just replied a week ago about the same situation here: https://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/po...l-5087505.html

    The movements are pretty much the same, except that the 4R36 has a shorter metal hub or whatever it's called, to accommodate the day wheel and C-clip. If you do get your hands on the Turtle dial + movement, it will fit in the Samurai case and you can just use the crown & stem from the Samurai. But keep in mind that the dial will be tilted to the side, and to fix that you will have to pull off the hands, remove the dial, clip the dial feet, file it smooth, adhere the dial to the movement, and re-set the hands. You will also have to replace the 4 o'clock day wheel with a 3 o'clock wheel, otherwise the day won't line up in the window correctly.

    If you want to put a day wheel on the 4R35, you will have to disassemble a few layers of the movement to replace that metal hub I mentioned, to accommodate the wheel. And of course, you will need to source the hub from a donor movement and a 3 o'clock day wheel. With day wheels going for $17-$20, you might want to consider buying a new NH36 3 o'clock movement (unbranded 4R36), going for $30-$45 on ebay. You'll also need to swap the standard movement holder of the 4R36 for the taller movement holder from the Samurai.
    Perfect answer. You are amazing!
    I'll look into it and see if the effort is worth the reward, but I like to mess around with things, so I'll probably end up doing it!

    Thanks again,

    Mike

  11. #10
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    Re: Seiko Samurai and Turtle differences help (mod)

    Np! If you're really considering going through with it, here are the methods for modding the movement that I consider from easiest to most difficult:
    1) starting with a 4r36 from a Turtle and swapping the 4 o'clock date wheel for a 3 o'clock wheel. Recommended tools - 1/8in or similar flat screwdriver with the edge sharpened & a pair of tweezers to remove & replace the C-clip.
    2) swapping the Samurai movement holder onto the NH36, which already comes with a 3 o'clock day wheel. Removing the spacer ring from both movements and placing one back onto the NH36 without bending the date wheel or touching the gears/regulator/balance wheel can be a little tricky, but is not too involved & requires no extra tools.
    3) converting the 4R35 to a 4R36 is by far the most involved & difficult. Taking apart just a few layers of the movement & putting it back together correctly can be tricky and time consuming.

    Good luck!
    Last edited by heywatchit!!; 4 Weeks Ago at 16:04.

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