To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

Thread: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

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  1. #1
    Member Horological-psychologist's Avatar
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    To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    A friend came to me with this watch. To me, it seems as if the bezel was, at some point, replaced, but looking at it in the steel, I'm not so sure. The model is number 5513 and the serial starts with 1,196,XXX and the movement is the Rolex 1530. Any information will be greatly appreciated.
    Carlos

    Working on the pictures, give me a few minutes.







    Last edited by Horological-psychologist; December 13th, 2016 at 03:46.

  2. #2
    Member Geof3's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    I would move this up to the fake busters box. It is relumed at the very least...
    Too many flipped...

  3. #3
    Member yankeexpress's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    The bezel looks horrible. And don't 5513 have fixed lug pins, as in permanently welded on thru the lugs?

    Last edited by yankeexpress; December 13th, 2016 at 07:56.

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  5. #4
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    From the pictures it is very hard to tell what is all going on with this watch.

    However, it is possible the 5513 has had a custom bezel fitted. Dial and hands look fine, patina showing not relumed in my opinion. I dont agree that it should be in the fake-busters section....after all it would be a very very poor fake with that bezel!. The case looks like it has been badly polished at some point and has lost its edges?

    The 5513 has normal spring bars, not fixed......the fixed bars are on the 5517, which was the Royal Navy issue submariner, so dont worry about that either.

    More pictures would be good to see.

  6. #5
    Member Horological-psychologist's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    Quote Originally Posted by S7KDD View Post
    From the pictures it is very hard to tell what is all going on with this watch.

    However, it is possible the 5513 has had a custom bezel fitted. Dial and hands look fine, patina showing not relumed in my opinion. I dont agree that it should be in the fake-busters section....after all it would be a very very poor fake with that bezel!. The case looks like it has been badly polished at some point and has lost its edges?

    The 5513 has normal spring bars, not fixed......the fixed bars are on the 5517, which was the Royal Navy issue submariner, so dont worry about that either.

    More pictures would be good to see.
    Thanks for the comments.

    This is what I think also, that something must have happened to the original bezel or maybe the original owner wanted to mod it because he/she liked the fluted bezel better, who knows.

    With regards to "more pictures", anything in particular that we should photograph?
    "The most dangerous thing in the world is an IGNORANT with INITIATIVE."
    Luis Muñoz Marín

  7. #6
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    It would be good to see some alternative shots of the movement with the rotor in different positions.

    It would also be great to see a close-up of the dial writing, both the depth rating and the 'swiss' marking below the 6o'clock marker.

  8. #7
    Member Gunnar_917's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    Quote Originally Posted by S7KDD View Post
    From the pictures it is very hard to tell what is all going on with this watch.

    However, it is possible the 5513 has had a custom bezel fitted. Dial and hands look fine, patina showing not relumed in my opinion. I dont agree that it should be in the fake-busters section....after all it would be a very very poor fake with that bezel!. The case looks like it has been badly polished at some point and has lost its edges?

    The 5513 has normal spring bars, not fixed......the fixed bars are on the 5517, which was the Royal Navy issue submariner, so dont worry about that either.

    More pictures would be good to see.
    Yep, this!

    I need some better pics of the dial. I'll give it the benefit of the doubt as from the pics you've posted there's nothing suggesting it looks like a fake. It just looks TERRIBLE with that bezel

  9. #8
    Member Rusty427's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    Looks real to me, though I'm not an expert.
    Metres first dial?! Circa 1969-70, http://www.5513mattedial.com/MetersFirst.html
    Not in the best shape, but still a vintage sub.
    If you are really serious about finding more about it, you could try the vintage Rolex section on The Rolex Forum.
    More pics as suggested by S7KDD

  10. #9
    Member Brisman's Avatar
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    To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    Better pics please, my initial reaction, apart from the obvious wrong bezel is a Gilt Dial 5513, which would be correct for the serial no, case back and 1530 movement.
    Puffy Lume plots are normal for mid sixties.

    Not a matte dial Metres First, serial no is too early.
    Last edited by Brisman; December 14th, 2016 at 00:16.
    IG - watchbrisman

  11. #10
    Member Horological-psychologist's Avatar
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    Re: To the vintage experts, have you ever seen this Submainer no date?

    I want to thank all of you who commented above.

    The watch is gone now, someone offered $5k for it and my friend sold it.
    Now I am just curious, why would someone pay that much for it? Maybe he can re-install the original bezel on it? Oh well, anyways, now it's gone.

    Thanks again!

    Carlos
    "The most dangerous thing in the world is an IGNORANT with INITIATIVE."
    Luis Muñoz Marín

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