Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

Thread: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

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  1. #1
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    Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Steinhart and Debaufre have the Ocean in a 39mm, Grovana has the Coral Reef, and Roberts the Poseidon 39mm.

    Is there any difference AT ALL in the watches themselves other than the name on the dial?

  2. #2
    Member Triton's Avatar
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Well, first of all, Steinhart does not offer its Ocean models in 39mm, only in 42mm. Secondly all four brands you've mentioned have different sources for their parts. Grovana is part of Revue Thommen which is a manufacturer of watches and watch parts with a long standing history, unlike the other three brands you've named. They used to manufacture Steinhart's Ocean models until about 2 years ago, when Steinhart changed the way of producing their watches.

    I can only speak for Steinhart, so I don't have a definate answer for you. If you seriously want to know, what the differences are, you're gonna have to get a watch from each brand or find someone who has one of each brand, in order to compare them.

  3. #3
    Member sbeams's Avatar
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Who manufactures Steinhart's current Ocean 1 now? It's just that all these brands, merging, splitting and private labels makes everything more confusing that it should be

    Omega SMP 2922.80.91
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    Steinhart Nav.B Chrono
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    I own multiple Oceans by both Steinhart and Debaufre. The coin edge on the Steinharts seems to be just a bit thicker (you would probably need a micrometer to know for sure), and my Debaufre Ocean Classic has an AR coating. Other than that, the differences are nominal (e.g. the numerals on the GMT's are a different font).
    Last edited by link2derek; March 1st, 2010 at 01:53.
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Quote Originally Posted by Triton View Post
    Secondly all four brands you've mentioned have different sources for their parts.
    Ok, thank you for clarifying. I was under the impression they are still being made by the same company/same parts. I think other people are still under that impression as well.

    I read a review of one of the Robert and the reviewer stated that he like the Robert bracelet better than the Steinhart. That statement is what triggered my question.

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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Quote Originally Posted by sbeams View Post
    Who manufactures Steinhart's current Ocean 1 now? It's just that all these brands, merging, splitting and private labels makes everything more confusing that it should be
    No need to be confused. If you need one company's name that produces the Steinhart Ocean models, then that one name will have to be Steinhart! Although Steinhart does not manufacture watches or watch parts at their premises in Augsburg, Germany, Steinhart also does not order watches, or even parts from a catalog of a watch/private label brand producer either.

    This is how things work in regards to Steinhart Timepieces: It's all about the design. Every single part of a Steinhart watch, except the basic movement, is designed and illustrated individually by me exclusively for Steinhart and then commissioned to different companies that will produce these parts according to the design and specification, also exclusively. There are at least 12 different suppliers producing these parts for Steinhart. All these parts and the movements are being sent to Steinhart's partner firm in Switzerland, who assembles the watch heads. This firm does not produce any parts. All they do, is assemble the watches and control their own work before sending the watch heads to Steinhart in Augsburg. Here a second, extensive quality control takes place by one of three master watchmakers, who are also responsible for servicing. The watches that pass the QC then receive their strap, buckle, hang tag, etc and are put in their box before they get shipped to you, the customer.

    Oh, and no, I didn't design the Ocean models. That was done long ago by another watch company, as we all know. The parts for Steinhart's Oceans where still drawn and comissioned, just like with all other Steinhart models. Nothing off the shelf, no re-labeled catalog watches. Just look at the current line of Ocean divers at steinhartwatches.de and try to find the number 10 on the bezel ...

    I hope this clears any possible confusion, at least in regards to Steinhart.

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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Thank you Trition, that explains the Steinhart position.

    It appears that all 4 are now independent of each other or is Steinhart and Debaufre the same watch/same company and simply called Debaufre in Europe?

    If I have the story right, at one time ALL were made by Grovana and now ALL are standalone "watch assemblers" if you will, and as a a result have slightly different products.

    When and why did Steinhart split off from Grovana?

    Was Robert and Steinhart split at the same time?

    Did Robert stay with Grovana, then split off later or did Robert split from Steinhart after Grovana?

    I have read the name change revolved around a similar sounding name in Europe which is why Steinhart is called Debaufre.

    It all may be clear to you, but if you poll 100 people many would say they still believe Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre and Robert to be exactly the same watches.

    Let's set the record straight here on WUS so everyone can separate fact from fiction.

  9. #8
    Member Triton's Avatar
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Oh my, so many question .... but I can only speak for Steinhart, I'm afraid.

    Frankly, the past is not of interest to us, we prefer to look forward. Only important thing to know is, that Steinhart is no longer connected to Robert and Debaufre and does not order from Grovana nor any other PLB supplier anymore!

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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Thank you Triton for this great post! Very informative and it helps me understand the process behind my Vintage Red I am liking more everyday.
    Seiko SKX781 Orange Monster
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  11. #10
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    Re: Steinhart, Grovana, Debaufre, Roberts

    Triton, I REALLY appreciate your insanely informative post. Good to know what's happening NOW instead of what was happening back then. It was a good move by Steinhart to break away from any strings because the quality is great!

    Edit: you said that there are about 12 different companies working together before being assembled in Switzerland...does this mean that some parts of Steinhart's timepieces come from China, then put together in Switzerland to get the "Swiss Made" label? Not trying to imply anything here--it's just interesting how these things come together :)
    Last edited by sbeams; March 1st, 2010 at 20:46.

    Omega SMP 2922.80.91
    Breitling Colt Chrono II
    Steinhart GMT Ocean 1 'PEPSI'
    Steinhart Nav.B Chrono
    TAG Heuer F1 Grande Date
    Seiko Chronograph SNAD05
    Akribos XXIV Saturnos

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