Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch
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  1. #1
    Member Bezelbub's Avatar
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    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Specifications taken from Orients site:

    Mechanical Movement : ORIENT caliber 40N5A Made in Japan
    Self-winding & Hand-winding movement
    (Second Hand halt mechanism)
    Enhanced shock proof
    22 jewels
    21600/hour vibrations
    Power reserve indicator, Date indicator

    Stainless steel case and bracelet
    One-way rotating bezel
    Sapphire crystal
    Screw case back
    Screwed-down crown
    Diameter 46.00mm
    Thickness 13.30mm
    Water resistant to 200m
    (Certificated by ISO 6425 diver' s watches, ISO 764 anti magnetic watches and ISO 1413 shock-resistant watches)

    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch (I posted tis review at Amazon also).

    I recently purchased the new Hackable, self wind, auto M-Force, power reserve indicator. First let me say that the watch and case are top notch. Heavy and extremely well made. Over 24 hours it has only showed a loss of 1.7 sec., so it's a great timekeeper also. While it is large (at 46mm) it fits comfortably on my wrist. The uni-directional rotating bezel turns smoothly and lines up perfectly to the watches indices. With the hackable feature, you are now able to set the exact time on the watch and being a hand-wind also, you can power up the watch easily without having to "shake" it to get it going. The case is polished, with the exception of the sides and flat surface on the back, which are brushed. The Orient logo and "Orient M-Force" on the case back is small and non-nondescript. I think the watch deserves something a bit bolder similar to the back of a Seiko "Monster". Take care when screwing down the crown to the closed position by pressing it in and turning it slowly clockwise to the full closed position. If not done carefully, there's a chance you could cross thread the outer stem. I have found that lower end watches similar to Orient, tend to have thin inner stems in their screw down crowns. This allows the crown to wobble a bit making it more difficult to engage the threads of the outer stem.

    The watch itself is quite heavy. With 3 links removed mine weighs 6.8 oz.

    Amazon lists the band width as 24mm, but it is actually 23mm, making it difficult to get a new strap or bracelet.

    On the other hand (and why I gave it only 4 stars) the SS bracelet is somewhat flimsy for a watch of this size and price. The end links attaching it to the case are fold over, not solid. The SS links, while solid, are on the thin side, and the deployant clasp is rather thin stamped stainless steel. It seems to me, as of late, this is getting to be common among Orients. For example, the thickness of the outer edge of the links on my much cheaper (and older) "Mako" is 3.42. as opposed to only 2.99mm on the "M-Force" (the center section of the links on each watch are both about 3.42mm). Outside of the different width, the clasp on the "Mako" and the "M-Force" are the same, so no improvement on the far more expensive M-Force.

    Another thing to note is that the link pins on the M-Force are not split, but have one "collared" end. So you will need a pusher that is smaller than the inside of the collared end to push the pin out when sizing the bracelet. I had to remove three links and fine adjust the end pin on the clasp to the middle hole to get a comfortable fit for my rather small 6.5" wrist.

    I purchased this watch from Island Watch. They sell at their own site and through Amazon, an shipping was free. This was actually the second M-Force I got. The first one died after I wound it up. Marc at Island Watch took care of the problem right away, sent me a shipping label for the return and supplied a new M-Force (the one in this review) in a few days. They provide very good service.
    The watch cost $319 at Island Watch when I got it, while at the time Amazon's price was quite a bit more expensive. But they are now are down to $320 at Amazon.

    Overall I am very happy with the watch, but would have liked a better quality bracelet.


    I have also kept the watch running since the initial review and timekeeping has somewhat degraded. It is now losing about 5 sec. per day. Still pretty good. This may get better or worse over time and I will keep you updated.

    UPDATE 3/11/13: Since the initial review the time keeping on M-Force has worsened, and it is now losing 14 sec per day.

    UPDATE 3/17/13: Things have improved on the M-Force hand wind's time keeping. Since the last update I have been keeping it in a winder and error has dropped to -8 sec. per day. going to wear it a few days and see what happens.

    Paul

    Here are the pictures with some notes.




    Attachment 1001418
    M-Force packaging.

    Attachment 1001421
    Inner Box

    Attachment 1001422
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Attachment 1001423
    View of dial. Offset crown avoids pinching between wrist and arm joint.

    Attachment 1001424
    Side view of M-Force case.

    Attachment 1001425
    Somewhat nondescript Orient logo on case back. The watch deserves something on par with the heavy logo on the Seiko Monsters.

    Attachment 1001426
    Orient logo laser etched on crown.

    Attachment 1001427
    Ever increasing size of men's watches. From left: M-Force- 46mm, Mako - 41mm, Vintage TAG Heuer - 38mm, 12 year old Movado Kingmatic Diver - 33mm, Vintage Hamilton 987S circa 1942-28mm.

    Attachment 1001435
    M-Force link showing collared pin. To size the bracelet yourself you will need a pusher pin SMALLER than the inside diameter of the collar. I used a Paylak TSLK3 Watch Band Pin Remover and Link Remover. An optivisor or loupe is a must when doing this.

    Attachment 1001438
    Comparison of the thinner lower quality M-Foce links (left) and the thicker Orient CFDAC004W Roman Numeral watch links (right). The CFDAC004W is 2 years old, cost $209 and has a bracelet FAR superior than the M-Force.

    Attachment 1001442
    Heavy solid SS end link on the less expensive CFDAC004W Roman Numeral watch.


    Attachment 1001440
    Note the cheap fold over end links of the more expensive and heavier M-Force.

    Attachment 1001445
    Comparison of SS clasps. M-Force (top) CFDAC004W (bottom). Note the cheap stamped thin SS clasp on the M-Force as compared to the far ticker high quality clasp on the CFDAC004W.

    Attachment 1001452
    Power reserve indicator. Note how 0 to 40 arc is sunken. A nice detail. The date window is located at the 9 O'clock position.

    Attachment 1001453
    Well rendered Orient logo on dial.

    Attachment 1001454
    Case is VERY well made. Nicely brushed side and polished shoulders.

    Attachment 1001455
    Smooth operating unidirectional bezel, having positive stops at each half second and lines up perfectly with second marks on the dial.

    Attachment 1001457
    The 13mm dial lays fairly well on my small wrist. Not a watch you can wear easily with a cuffed shirt though. Note lugs overhang my small wrist, but not too bad.

    Attachment 1001459
    Another wrist view of the M-Force. My wrist is only 6.5".

    Attachment 1001462
    Bottom view on wrist.

    Attachment 1001464
    A nice detail is the orange sunken band around the crown, reflecting the orange dial of the watch.

    Attachment 1001465
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.

    Attachment 1001466
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.

    Attachment 1001467
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.

    Attachment 1001468
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.

    Attachment 1001470
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.

    Attachment 1001471
    Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch.
    Last edited by Bezelbub; March 18th, 2013 at 04:33. Reason: Update
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  2. #2
    Gai
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    Re: Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Nice and honest review.. You may like to check out my orient 300m pictorial review as well. I have to say the time keeping on my orient 300m isn't that good, it is like +20 sec/ day right now. Pretty bad you may say, but the watch was bought brand new from Seiya.. I suppose I need to give it some time for the watch to settle down. I will also try experimenting with positioning the watch. I have an orient mako XL coming soon as well. You just piqued my interest in this m-force but I will probably wait for the latest titanium m-force as well.

  3. #3
    Member Bezelbub's Avatar
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    Re: Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Hi Gai,

    I'll certainly check out the 300m review. I have to update the M-Force review also, as it's timekeeping has worsened, and is now losing 17 sec. per day. In fact it seems that timing on Orients aren't what they were. Most of my Orients were bought over a year and a half ago, but just recently I got three more; the M-Force, Millenium and Sky. Each of these watches kept poor time as compared to my older ones. I regulated the Sky, and Millenium myself, and they now keep very good time. I will have to do this with the M-Force also. It seems Orient's watches are leaving the factory not as well regulated as before.
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  5. #4
    Member kore's Avatar
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    Re: Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    nice review... does it hard to do self-regulating on this m-force?

  6. #5
    Member Bezelbub's Avatar
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    Re: Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Kore,

    I'm still holding off on regulating the M-Force. I checked it again after 3 days and loss rate was down to -8.3 seconds. Today I reset it and put it into a winder to see how it does. The hardest thing for me about regulating a watch is getting the case back off CAREFULLY so as not to damage or scratch it. I have various tools for doing this. I would expect the M-Force, being a diver, has the back screwed on very securely, and remember, opening the watch voids any warranty! That being said, I have regulated quite a few of my wrist watches. Tonight I did my new Orient Orient IP 21-Jewel Automatic Disk Watch #ER02004B. Again, the case back was difficult to get off, but the regulation fairly easy. I invested in a MT-1000 electronic timer which makes regulation far easier and faster than moving the regulator and waiting 24 hours to see the results via comparison time.

  7. #6
    Member Tseg's Avatar
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    Re: Orient Men's SEL03002M M-Force Automatic and Hand-Wind Watch

    Quote Originally Posted by Bezelbub View Post
    Kore,

    I'm still holding off on regulating the M-Force. I checked it again after 3 days and loss rate was down to -8.3 seconds. Today I reset it and put it into a winder to see how it does. The hardest thing for me about regulating a watch is getting the case back off CAREFULLY so as not to damage or scratch it. I have various tools for doing this. I would expect the M-Force, being a diver, has the back screwed on very securely, and remember, opening the watch voids any warranty! That being said, I have regulated quite a few of my wrist watches. Tonight I did my new Orient Orient IP 21-Jewel Automatic Disk Watch #ER02004B. Again, the case back was difficult to get off, but the regulation fairly easy. I invested in a MT-1000 electronic timer which makes regulation far easier and faster than moving the regulator and waiting 24 hours to see the results via comparison time.
    Bezelbub, not sure if you still have the watch above? In a short time frame I bought both the M-Force Beast and OSD with the 40N5A movement. Similar to you, I experienced significant time loss early on. What I do know is when both lay dial down they gain a second or two in a 12 hour period (overnight), on their sides they lose a second or two overnight and dial up they lose 20+ seconds. For this week I've worn the OSD during the day and M-Force at night and began keeping a log on a spreadsheet. Both are about 2 month old. This week the OSD has averaged -7.3 second loss per day and the M-Force at -7.5 second lost. Interesting how close they are. However, when I would wear one 24/7 the loss would be 10 - 15 seconds as they would not have the 8 - 12 hour window laying face down to "recuperate its losses".

    Losing less than 8 seconds per day while making accommodations is not horrible, nor is it great. I'm wondering whether the accuracy of your M-Force has changed in the past year? I do not want to regulate either as I do not want to mess with their seals and create bigger problems. Any update would be appreciated.

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