Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?
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    Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    I have been wondering how good are seagull movements anyway? Are they as good as an ETA or valjou movement? And if not why not? Are the swiss movements that much better built,really? From what I have been reading they are the Rolex of the Chinese Market.So what I mean is there any of the movements equal to that of high end Swiss made watches?Im learning so as much info would be helpful. Thanks

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    CMW & Sales Moderator gigfy's Avatar
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    I would think that the tourbillons, minute repeaters, & perpetual calendars would be top of the line in quality but maybe not as well finished as the Swiss $100K movements. I wouldn't know personally, but I did read that in a nice article about Chinese watches in IW magazine.

    For movements I can actually afford, our friendly neighborhood watchmaker gave a pretty good endorsement for the ST2130 (ETA 2824 equivalent).

    The Seagull, however, is not “just a copy” of he ETA 2824-2. It is a re-engineered version of the ETA 2824-2. Unnecessary, wasteful and difficult processes have been removed and a more simplified process put in their place. This is another way Seagull can spend more time on making the outside pretty, without increasing the production time and thus controlling the cost.

    Which one would I use in a watch, if I were to make one (on a mass scale)? The Seagull.
    https://forums.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=216945

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    Just to name a few:
    Sharkey SBDX001 Sharkmaster
    Seiko White Stargate SKZ323
    Hamilton Pioneer Mechanical H60419533
    Hamilton Limited Edition Pocket Watch H51459013
    Timex Camper Mechanical (May 1991)

    -Gone
    Minorva Crazy Hours Mechanical
    Shanghai Military Diver Model 114 - 24 Jewel SS4 Automatic

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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    What makes a good movement good?
    The watch/clock keeps ticking, but why are some movements considered better then others - is it the time spent on making it? The craftsmanship?
    Do not try to confuse me with facts!

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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    Quote Originally Posted by Back View Post
    What makes a good movement good?
    The watch/clock keeps ticking, but why are some movements considered better then others - is it the time spent on making it? The craftsmanship?
    A Corolla is a great car, gets you A to B economically, but a E-Class is just a bit nicer ride.

    The difference in good movements and great movements is very subjective, some want robust construction and a legacy of reliability, others want top engineering, style and luxury and are willing to pay extra.

    We should be very pleased that we can appreciate all levels of WIS economics and still arrive at our meetings on time regardless of what we strap on our wrists.
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    Member lysanderxiii's Avatar
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    Quote Originally Posted by wmjsajudge View Post
    I have been wondering how good are seagull movements anyway? Are they as good as an ETA or valjou movement? And if not why not? Are the swiss movements that much better built,really? From what I have been reading they are the Rolex of the Chinese Market.So what I mean is there any of the movements equal to that of high end Swiss made watches?Im learning so as much info would be helpful. Thanks
    Yes and no.

    The movements are every bit as reliable, robust and accurate a timekeeper as the Standard grade ETA movements, and Seagull could match the higher grades, in all probability if they chose to.

    But, there are the little non-essential things that detract from appearance, shellac with bubbles in it, poor clean up on the underside of the bridges. One of the wonderful things about ETAs in the past (around 2000) was they were very affordable, under $50, maybe as low as $35, a unit for a Standard grade 2824-2 depending on the size of the order. For that kind of price, the superficial appearance related advantages of "Swiss Made" were worth it. Now, that the price of an ETA 2824-2 has increases several times, the Seagull (and the Hangzhou, which, by the way, I like a tiny bit more) are a better value, as they still mechanically work as well, and they are better decorated.

    There are just tw
    o things I wish Seagull would do that would improve the apparent quality of their movements: 1) reduce the thickness of the chrome plate or switch to hard chrome, nickel or rhodium plating, and 2) increase the cutter speed and reduce the feed speed when making the Côte de Genève (or switch to a brass disc with grinding compound.)

    By "high end" do you mean Vacheron Constantin or Piaget etc, with their really expensive stuff they possibly, [EDIT: probably] not, but I haven't had a chance to compare...
    Last edited by lysanderxiii; January 19th, 2010 at 13:45.
    familiaritas parit contemptum; raritate admiratione wins.- Lucius Apuleius
    est necessry, accurate ad secundo? - Lysander magna
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    Mod. Russian, China Mech. Chascomm's Avatar
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    If you regard ETA and Valjoux (also ETA) as the 'high end' of Swiss mechanical movements, what then is the low end?

    The Chinese 'high end' is not anywhere as high as the Swiss high end, however when you look at complicated movements like tourbillons, then the difference in value becomes obvious. $60,000 in a Swiss tourbillon gets you a basic tourbillon, no additional complications, in a simple case, or a Chinese tourbillon, finished in Switzerland, in a really nice case. The same money in a Chinese watch would get you a double-tourbillon, or a single-tourbillon with minute repeater, in a really nice custom case. Either way would be largely 'hand-made'. For 1% of that price, you can get a basic Chinese tourbillon in a simple steel or gold-tone case; or from Switzerland, a basic ETA auto in a waterproof steel case.

    Really, there is only so far you can take the comparison due to the price difference. That may change however, if the Swatch Group have any success with their new budget mechanical movements (including chronograph). That fact that they have bothered to introduce new entry-level movements suggests to me that they are reacting to the Chinese, because the Chinese watch industry have figured out what the buyers really want; affordable luxury that sacrifices some refinement but offers more added features. I mean, if I just want something that tells the time, I can look at my phone.

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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    Here is the latest watch with ST2130 26 jewels movement, looks terrific!



    bigger one
    Last edited by testdig; January 20th, 2010 at 01:37.
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    How would, say Beijing's "Playing Dragon and Phoenix" watch, rank in terms of craftsmanship among the Swiss offerings? Ignoring price, which comes in at a measly 150K USD, would it be safe to assume that quality and craftsmanship is on par with the upper tiers of the Swiss watch industry?

    Link

  10. #9
    Member testdig's Avatar
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    Quote Originally Posted by linsook View Post
    How would, say Beijing's "Playing Dragon and Phoenix" watch, rank in terms of craftsmanship among the Swiss offerings? Ignoring price, which comes in at a measly 150K USD, would it be safe to assume that quality and craftsmanship is on par with the upper tiers of the Swiss watch industry?

    Link
    LOL, buddy, the "Playing Dragon and Phoenix" translation is so coool
    I'm saving money for "Pocket watch to commemorate the sixtieth anniversary of founding of the Republic", too many watches are in my want list ...

    Last edited by testdig; January 20th, 2010 at 02:13.
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    Re: Seagull Movemnets as good as Swiss movements?

    It is a little different then cars. As it is about time keeping. I would think Seagull can make a movement that keeps just as good as time.

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